it would also be cheeper if we gave each member of the death row 3 appeals (to be execuited within 3 years)(pardon the pun) once the day comes - high noon and a single bullet
class 1996
Progressives look at reality through the lens of Liberalism
Eliminate Death Row and put the scum in with the general population. Most would be taken care of by their fellow inmates...and good riddance.
I'm quite sure that virtually every death row inmate would LOVE to be in gen pop. I'm pretty sure this wouldn't be a punishment for them as compared to being on death row.
Eliminate Death Row and put the scum in with the general population. Most would be taken care of by their fellow inmates...and good riddance.
I'm quite sure that virtually every death row inmate would LOVE to be in gen pop. I'm pretty sure this wouldn't be a punishment for them as compared to being on death row.
IMO It is cruel and unusual punishment the way we drag on the Death Penalty. We need it to go away
I'm kind of on the fence on this issue. I don't mind that the death penalty exists and I have no moral issues with the state taking the life of somebody who commits crimes worthy of the death penalty ... but anytime there's even the slightest most remote chance that the person is innocent of the crime, I don't like the idea of it. You just can't undo death.
And I personally think that life in prison is a much worse punishment than death anyway, so if it is costing us that much money per death row inmate, maybe it does make sense to get rid of it.
And I am adamantly against limiting appeals as a cost saving device ... for the reasons I mentioned above. You can't be too sure when a person's life is literally at stake.
Eliminate Death Row and put the scum in with the general population. Most would be taken care of by their fellow inmates...and good riddance.
I'm quite sure that virtually every death row inmate would LOVE to be in gen pop. I'm pretty sure this wouldn't be a punishment for them as compared to being on death row.
I don't agree. There are many on death row that committed crimes involving children. If they were in the general population they wouldn't have to worry about how the state was going to put them to death, only how one of their fellow inmates was going to do so.
Eliminate Death Row and put the scum in with the general population. Most would be taken care of by their fellow inmates...and good riddance.
I'm quite sure that virtually every death row inmate would LOVE to be in gen pop. I'm pretty sure this wouldn't be a punishment for them as compared to being on death row.
I don't agree. There are many on death row that committed crimes involving children. If they were in the general population they wouldn't have to worry about how the state was going to put them to death, only how one of their fellow inmates was going to do so.
I'm not sure that's as true as people make it out to be. There are literally tens of thousands of people that have committed sexual offenses against children. They served prison time and seemed to make it out. Maybe they're not housed with the same crew that would be willing to up their respective sentences another 50 or so years by committing a homicide. Anyway.....
I'm not comfortable with the death penalty for a couple of reasons. First and foremost, as BAC noted, there's the chance that we could end up killing someone that was truly innocent. It also appears to be a lot more expensive to execute someone that it does to keep them locked up.
I know people want to do away with the seemingly endless appeals process. But if we do that, we will effectively end the death penalty. It won't take but a few years to kill someone that will eventually be proven innocent. And there's go the death penalty entirely.
It also seems that the deciding factor in deciding whether or not to pursue corporal punishment is money. Remember when they first started prosecuting O.J.? The question of the death penalty was raised and they said, "Oh, don't worry. There's no way we'll try to execute O.J." Why the hell not if he was guilty? I understand that people with a lot of wealth will always have the upper hand in our legal system but when we're talking about killing people........
I certainly think there are people that are deserving of the ultimate punishment. But I don't think there's a system that could be implemented that would be cost effective, ensure only those that are truly guilty receive it, and is fair.
Joined: 30 Aug 2004 Posts: 1448 Location: New York City 584 eGriz Bucks
Hells bells wrote:
blame the lawyers
Read "The Innocent Man," by John Grisham, if you think death penalty cases get too much "lawyering." (For those who aren't familiar with the book, it is nonfiction, even though it's by Grisham -- and an excellent read.)
I don't necessarily oppose the death penalty, but if we're going to execute people, we have to be right. Not 90% of the time, not 99.9% of the time...but always. It's easy to be outraged by the cost, but if it saves innocent people from being executed (and it has), then I'm all for it.
But, I know...it's a lot easier to just "blame the lawyers" than it is to actually think about these things, right?
"I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous. And God granted it." --Voltaire
There are a lot of good points being made. I suspect that opinions of some would change dramatically if one of their family members was the victim of a capital crime. I cannot imagine being the family of a victim.
I don't blame the lawyers, they are doing what they are paid to do.
Joined: 06 Aug 2003 Posts: 4651 Location: NE corner of the NEZ 6635 eGriz Bucks
Grizlaw wrote:
Hells bells wrote:
blame the lawyers
Read "The Innocent Man," by John Grisham, if you think death penalty cases get too much "lawyering." (For those who aren't familiar with the book, it is nonfiction, even though it's by Grisham -- and an excellent read.)
I don't necessarily oppose the death penalty, but if we're going to execute people, we have to be right. Not 90% of the time, not 99.9% of the time...but always. It's easy to be outraged by the cost, but if it saves innocent people from being executed (and it has), then I'm all for it.
But, I know...it's a lot easier to just "blame the lawyers" than it is to actually think about these things, right?
It is an excellent book, I will agree with you on that (there's a first)
regardless of who wrote it, and Grisham is a great author, by about anyones standards - except of course a few smug types I have met who are in the law biz (and it's a biz...very little more than that) It's like they feel threatened or somehting by Grisham or the need to belittle him in some way....why is that?
back on subject, amazing story and opened my eyes quite a bit to the whole death sentance thing, and pretty much has helped to solidify my dislike for the American legal system and especially the Gov-mints control and manipulation of it all.
Talk about a joke: Starting at the top = THE Gov-Mint, the manipulation of the laws over the years, the courts the SCOTUS, the judges, most of lawyers most of the plaintiffs and defendants, the police and the prison system to the criminals and even the whole parole and social workers.....it's all morally bankrupt and long over due for some sort of complete carcass toss.
Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But of course, I repeat myself..."
-Samuel L. Clemens
Read "The Innocent Man," by John Grisham, if you think death penalty cases get too much "lawyering." (For those who aren't familiar with the book, it is nonfiction, even though it's by Grisham -- and an excellent read.)
I don't necessarily oppose the death penalty, but if we're going to execute people, we have to be right. Not 90% of the time, not 99.9% of the time...but always. It's easy to be outraged by the cost, but if it saves innocent people from being executed (and it has), then I'm all for it.
But, I know...it's a lot easier to just "blame the lawyers" than it is to actually think about these things, right?
Wow! A civil debate, nice. I admit that I'm kind of a fence sitter on this one. I used to be very pro death penalty, but the system is to flawed and to many innocent people are on death row. To be quite honest, if the death penalty was abolished, I would have no problem with it.
Joined: 08 Jan 2008 Posts: 190 Location: grand coulee,wa 190 eGriz Bucks
Bay Area Cat wrote:
I'm kind of on the fence on this issue. I don't mind that the death penalty exists and I have no moral issues with the state taking the life of somebody who commits crimes worthy of the death penalty ... but anytime there's even the slightest most remote chance that the person is innocent of the crime, I don't like the idea of it. You just can't undo death.
And I personally think that life in prison is a much worse punishment than death anyway, so if it is costing us that much money per death row inmate, maybe it does make sense to get rid of it.
And I am adamantly against limiting appeals as a cost saving device ... for the reasons I mentioned above. You can't be too sure when a person's life is literally at stake.
BAC... agree with you completely here! We've heard, recently, of people in the slammer for 20+ years that now appear to be innocent!
I once listened to a catholic conservative pose the question that if we as a societly deam that the taking of life is wrong, than from whom do we in turn receive the mandate to punish by the further taking of life?
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act". Orwell
I once listened to a catholic conservative pose the question that if we as a societly deam that the taking of life is wrong, than from whom do we in turn receive the mandate to punish by the further taking of life?
Was the Catholic referring to the death pentalty or possibly abortion. I think there are many who wonder how people get so worked up over the possibility that someone on death row may have a miniscule chance he was put there by mistake, yet those same people will fight over the right to an abortion on demand. Not trying to stir anything up, but it seems to me they have a point.
I don't necessarily oppose the death penalty, but if we're going to execute people, we have to be right. Not 90% of the time, not 99.9% of the time...but always. It's easy to be outraged by the cost, but if it saves innocent people from being executed (and it has), then I'm all for it.
GL
it would be very rare that anyone who is found guilty is indeed innocent unless in their own warped viewpoint, or try and manipulate our justice system to get away with their crime.
class 1996
Progressives look at reality through the lens of Liberalism
I once listened to a catholic conservative pose the question that if we as a societly deam that the taking of life is wrong, than from whom do we in turn receive the mandate to punish by the further taking of life?
Was the Catholic referring to the death pentalty or possibly abortion. I think there are many who wonder how people get so worked up over the possibility that someone on death row may have a miniscule chance he was put there by mistake, yet those same people will fight over the right to an abortion on demand. Not trying to stir anything up, but it seems to me they have a point.
He was definitely speaking to the death penalty, and implying the reverse of your point - the hypocrisy of being pro-life and pro-death penalty.
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act". Orwell
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class 1996
