My recollection is that Joyce was hoping for offers from CU and KSU, but had some lesser I-A offers. Thus, I think his situation was relevant.
I don't know why some of you can only focus on the worst teams UM has played in recent years, like Fort Lewis--and can't seem to remember the good competition, good games and playoffs. However, if that bothered me that much, I would find something else to do on Saturdays.
He had grayshirt offers at CU and CSU and a scholarship offer at Idaho.
In my estimation, for every Tyler Joyce, or guy that will turn down an FBS scholarship for true freshman playing time and winning in FCS, there are at least 2 players who will completely disregard FCS schools based on the principle that they aren't really "D-I."
Wasn't Alex Shaw holding out for a Pac-10 or Idaho offer and settled for UM?
Rob Overton was hoping to go to Idaho but they pulled their offer and ended up at UM.
These guys were considered big time signings by UM and wouldn't even be here if the lowest team in the WAC decided to pull the trigger.
Let's not kid ourselves and pretend that the FBS/FCS distinction doesn't matter to the upper caliber recruits that UM targets. Guys like Joyce are the exception and not the rule.
General, so you consider Colorado and Kansas State (schools Joyce was hoping to get a full offer from) and Washington State (Shaw) to be lesser/lower programs?
Also, I don't recall Overton waiting for an offer from Idaho. What's your source on that?
General, so you consider Colorado and Kansas State (schools Joyce was hoping to get a full offer from) and Washington State (Shaw) to be lesser/lower programs?
Also, I don't recall Overton waiting for an offer from Idaho. What's your source on that?
No. However, Idaho could be considered a "lesser program". Joyce chose UM over Idaho, Shaw and Overton wanted to go to FBS schools and would have gone to Idaho if they could have.
Overton had an offer from Idaho and was very interested and planning on going there, but there was a SNAFU on Idaho's part and they ended up not having enough scholarships. The offer was withdrawn and he ended up at UM. Articles, reports, his own words, scout.com, etc . . .
[[[[O'Day reasoned that factors like watching Montana players and the team’s readiness to compete would weigh heavily on the minds of the fans. When guessing what their stance on the issue would be, he said he “bet it favors, at least 10-to-1, to stay where we’re at.” Not quite.
In a poll on eGriz.com, a popular Internet message board for Montana Grizzlies diehards, 53 percent of the 128 people who responded said they would like to see the University of Montana move up to the FBS. It’s worth noting that this only represents the fanatics and not necessarily your average fan.]]]]
...HELLO! Is O'Day out of touch or what? BTW Colin, FANatic means fan
General, your info on where these guys wanted to go, is not correct.
Please for the sanity of this board and thread, lets not go there. I have a feeling this thread is about to become some sort of match that it should not be amongst a few egrizzers that have a history of jawing back and forth. Please keep it civil.
I for one, do not care who is right or wrong about this or any subject here. How nice would it be if we all could just respect one another here without proving who is right or wrong. I think EGRIZ faithful know the posters that we can take as being pretty accurate more often than not.
PS, Thanks for trying to provide some insight here GD. This egrizzer appreciates it.
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CFallsGriz wrote:
[[[[O'Day reasoned that factors like watching Montana players and the team’s readiness to compete would weigh heavily on the minds of the fans. When guessing what their stance on the issue would be, he said he “bet it favors, at least 10-to-1, to stay where we’re at.” Not quite.
In a poll on eGriz.com, a popular Internet message board for Montana Grizzlies diehards, 53 percent of the 128 people who responded said they would like to see the University of Montana move up to the FBS. It’s worth noting that this only represents the fanatics and not necessarily your average fan.]]]]
...HELLO! Is O'Day out of touch or what? BTW Colin, FANatic means fan
I know, but if in your mind 'fanatic' and 'average fan' gives you the same image, i'm sorry.
With the current administration it doesn't matter what the fanatic or the average fans want, the Griz will not make a move. They would rather be reactive than proactive and move when they feel they have no choice. However, by then they will probably be too late and the WAC won't be an option.
Also, you're naive if you think a move to the WAC wouldn't increase the amount of financial support the university would receive.
What would happen to their support if the Griz moved down? So would the $$ given to them.
Is there any support for this statement?: "Also, you're naive if you think a move to the WAC wouldn't increase the amount of financial support the university would receive."
Would the WAC increase financial support by $5 million per year--the figure O'Day says the budget would need to increase?
Would the WAC cause financial support to increase by $5 million per year BEFORE the move to the WAC occurred--which is when Hogan and O'Day have said it would have to occur.
Personally, I think some of you are naive for thinking that moving up, even to the WAC, would suddenly cause oodles of money to flow in the door of the UM athletic department. It just doesn't happen that way, except in Field of Dreams.
My support for that statement is a. common sense and b. any and every other school that made the move has seen an increase in $$ support. Go ahead, look it up. Even Idaho.
The 5 million dollar figure is bogus. Look up every athletic budget in the WAC and tell me that it's 5 million more than the Griz current budget. I'll bet you can't.
Both O'Day and the App St AD said moving up would need to increase by $5 million. Are you really saying you know more about athletic dept costs than these AD's? Too funny.
DPW, give us the stats on how much the dollar support increased, and when, at other schools that moved up. If you're saying only that it will agree by a modest amount, then I might agree with you. If you're saying it's obvious it will increase by $5 million, I call BS to that.
DPW, you seem to not understand that O'Day and the App St AD are saying their budgets will have to INCREASE by that amount. Comparing the UM budget to the budgets is not the proper analysis. Athletic departments can look at their own current expenses and then figure out approximately how much expenses would increase. It does no good to look at what someone else's budget is, as their situation is different.
DPW, I think most of your comments are "bogus", to use your term. Again, how you can some of you be serious about saying the estimations of current athletic directors, as well as people like UM's former AD Hogan, are bogus?
Player, please be reminded....O'Day is looking at someone else's information. He doesn't have a feasibility study for UM because Dennison says he doesn't need one. Again, we don't have an estimate of projected revenues after the move to The WAC. We (you) continue to talk only about projected expenses. Why? We are talking too much about money. Are there other disadvantages to a move? Advantages, perhaps? Those of us that want a change feel it is in the best interests of UM and presented properly to The Board of Regents, Governor and Legislature, will most likely be approved. There are those resisting change, many, I believe, simply because they fear the unknown. I know that the majority want the best for UM....let's look at all options openly without the continued argument.
Player, please be reminded....O'Day is looking at someone else's information. He doesn't have a feasibility study for UM because Dennison says he doesn't need one. Again, we don't have an estimate of projected revenues after the move to The WAC. We (you) continue to talk only about projected expenses. Why? We are talking too much about money. Are there other disadvantages to a move? Advantages, perhaps? Those of us that want a change feel it is in the best interests of UM and presented properly to The Board of Regents, Governor and Legislature, will most likely be approved. There are those resisting change, many, I believe, simply because they fear the unknown. I know that the majority want the best for UM....let's look at all options openly without the continued argument.
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Spanky, you don't know what O'Day is looking at, you don't know what Hogan looked at, and you don't know what you're talking about on this subject. They are/were not looking at other people's figures.
As I have said before, one doesn't need a feasibility study to have a good idea what the costs will be and what the revenues are likely to be. Again, you show your lack of knowledge on this subject. I work with feasibilty studies frequently, and I know what they are and what they are used for. I have looked at feasibility studies for moving up, and know what they tend to cover (and not cover). Have you looked at any?
It is not true that I and others have not addressed potential increases in revenues, nor that we have not addressed other reasons for not moving up. Jeez, you actually praised one of my posts that addressed other reasons for not moving up.
Why don't you take some of your own advice, and address some of the points that a number have made for reasons not to move up?
Player....As a business CEO of 30 years, I think I know what a feasibility study may be. In one of the articles posted on another thread, O'Day was quoted stating he uses the feasibility studies of other schools. I attempted to extend the olive branch to you that I'm not interested in you telling me that I don't know what I'm talking about, nor the continued argument. I don't believe the Big Sky Conference is a quality conference and UM should look elsewhere for membership..very simple. I also believe, and have stated so previously that I don't think anything will happen until Dennison retires, so you will be able to continue watching The Griz win against inferior teams for the next several years....enjoy!
Player....As a business CEO of 30 years, I think I know what a feasibility study may be. In one of the articles posted on another thread, O'Day was quoted stating he uses the feasibility studies of other schools. I attempted to extend the olive branch to you that I'm not interested in you telling me that I don't know what I'm talking about, nor the continued argument. I don't believe the Big Sky Conference is a quality conference and UM should look elsewhere for membership..very simple. I also believe, and have stated so previously that I don't think anything will happen until Dennison retires, so you will be able to continue watching The Griz win against inferior teams for the next several years....enjoy!
I find that interesting because I don't recall a school that did an announced feasibility study that didn't go ahead with the move. App. State and Montana have never annouced one. WKU did and they moved, UConn did, they moved, Troy did and they moved, FIU and FAU did and they moved. Texas State did and have announced they will move and Jacksonville State did the same. These two will be gone as soon as the moratorium is over. Georgia Southern is doing one now and look for them to join TSU and JSU.
So if O'Day is indeed going by other schools feasibility studies then it's puzzling they are all going ahead but O'Day says it's unfeasable to do so. Sounds like political double talk.
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I have a feeling this thread is about to become some sort of match that it should not be amongst a few egrizzers that have a history of jawing back and forth. Please keep it civil.
