Selection criteria for the playoffs

OK here is a link to the selection criteria for playoff selection.

http://www.cstv.com/features_fad_111703a.htm

If we WIN this weekend our chances for a top seed should be pretty good and I'll tell you why.

Read this selection criteria.

3. The committee may give more consideration to those teams playing all Div. I opponents. Pretty straightforward, and the reason why I have been analyzing playoff fields with unmatched success for five years in the same manner. See the Sub-Div I (NS) column in the analyses below.

So, they count a loss as a loss. And they count a Div II game as a Div. II game. A loss counts the same no matter to who Div. I or Div. II. And a Div. II game counts the same whether you win it or lose it.

Example:

Montana 10-2 with one Div. II game.

Umass 10-2 with one NS game.

Western Kentucky 9-3 with two Div. II games.

The way I read it is that a Div. II game is weighted against you either way and the outcome isn't even in the equation except that it affects the overall win-loss record.

Your total win-loss record with Div. II and NS games considered for SOS.

Comments and thoughts?

I have a comment....First it would have been nice to beat NDSU, but why did we schedule them in the first place? It seems to me win or lose it doesn't help. The problem with those types of games is that they are easy to look past. Losing puts you in a bad position and winning doesn't say anything. I feel we should play a championship caliber schedule every year. No DII's, no St Marys, ect. In 1AA there is a National Championship out there. We need to win the BSC however the ultimate goal should be the NC game.

Now for a thought....I think that once we destroy the kitties, the DII game won't be an issue. It's all about the $$$. 23,500 butts gets us home games till we go to the champioship game.

I heard from a very good source that the Griz are going to be just fine in the seeding :wink:

grizpack said:

I heard from a very good source that the Griz are going to be just fine in the seeding :wink:

Click to expand...

'if ya know what I mean' huh?

ronbo said:

....

Read this selection criteria.

3. The committee may give more consideration to those teams playing all Div. I opponents. Pretty straightforward, and the reason why I have been analyzing playoff fields with unmatched success for five years in the same manner. See the Sub-Div I (NS) column in the analyses below.

So, they count a loss as a loss. And they count a Div II game as a Div. II game. A loss counts the same no matter to who Div. I or Div. II. And a Div. II game counts the same whether you win it or lose it.

Example:

Montana 10-2 with one Div. II game.

Umass 10-2 with one NS game.

Western Kentucky 9-3 with two Div. II games.

The way I read it is that a Div. II game is weighted against you either way and the outcome isn't even in the equation except that it affects the overall win-loss record.

Your total win-loss record with Div. II and NS games considered for SOS.

Comments and thoughts?

Click to expand...

Now, where do you get that a div II win or loss counts the same whether you win or lose it?

Basically, a win against a div II team is as if a team didn't play any game at all. Loss will count big. The fewer division II or (NS) teams on the schedule and more div. I games the better the seeding. UMASS won their division II game, Griz didn't. UMASS should be seeded higher than Griz.
McNeese State did not play a division II or non-div I team, so naturally, McNeese State will be seeded higher.

ronbo said:

3. The committee may give more consideration to those teams playing all Div. I opponents. Pretty straightforward, and the reason why I have been analyzing playoff fields with unmatched success for five years in the same manner. See the Sub-Div I (NS) column in the analyses below.

So, they count a loss as a loss. And they count a Div II game as a Div. II game. A loss counts the same no matter to who Div. I or Div. II. And a Div. II game counts the same whether you win it or lose it.
The way I read it is that a Div. II game is weighted against you either way and the outcome isn't even in the equation except that it affects the overall win-loss record.

Your total win-loss record with Div. II and NS games considered for SOS.

Comments and thoughts?

Click to expand...

While a game vs sub-division I teams counts less in the comittee's official thinking loss is certainly worse than a win. meaning if two teams are ranked similarly and have the same win/loss record the team with a loss to a DivII team would be in slightly less standing.

Obviously, there is more to all this than that though.

In our case a bigger issue is weather or not Delaware beats Villanova.

The teams below have at least an outside chance at one of the top 4 seeds.

1. McNeese State Cowboys (80) 9-1 2,236 1
If they win this weekend they're a lock for the #1 seed even though the Southland is not so hot this year.

2. Wofford Terriers (6) 10-1 2,111 4
I wouldn't be surprised to see Wofford as a 4 seed. they barely won their last game and dont draw as well as UM or UD and havn't been in the playoffs in some time if at all. the SoCon is weak this year and that won't help Wofford. However, their only loss was vs DivI-A Airforce and they did win their one DivII game. So on the other hand I suppose the comittee might like them and give them the 2 seed.

3. Delaware Blue Hens (1) 10-1 2,003 6
Beat Navy and won their DII game, and draw big crowds. If both the Griz and UD win then UD will get a slight edge in seeding.

4. Montana Grizzlies (3) 9-2 1,929 5
We beat MSU i can't see how we aren't at least a 4th seed.

5. Southern Illinois Salukis 10-1 1,720 2
I think we have an edge over Southern Ill, as they played 2 sub 1-aa teams, and have no recent history of making the playoffs.

6. Colgate Raiders 11-0 1,661 7
Patriot league? not gonna make a top 4 seed unless 2 or 3 teams ranked better lose.

7. Massachusetts Minutemen 9-2 1,650 3
A div 2 win and a 1-a loss. Still, need's higher ranked teams to lose.

8. Northern Iowa Panthers 9-2 1,630 11
both losses come to good teams in WKU and Iowa State(by 7)
but one win vs Northern Mich who i think is divII, but i'm not sure.
Still, they need 2 teams above them to lose.

One thing is certain, i'm glad we have playoffs

I'll defend Hogan somewhat on this one. We had NDSU on the schedule to add a seventh home game. That means more dollars in the coffers, and more contributions from local businesses that know the impact Griz Saturday has on their bottom lines, which all translates to a stronger program. Scheduling isn't like the movie "Field of Dreams"...build it and they will come. There is a shortage of Div. 1-AA teams west of the Mississippi and note the rest of the Big Sky is also scheduling the likes of S. Utah, N. Colorado, UC Davis etc. So if their dance card is filled they can't come here anytime we need to fill out our home schedule.

So, even though I'm sure he didn't want to schedule a Div. 2 game, at least it was a team that had a chance to compete with the Griz and give us value for our dollars. Next year is all 1-AA, with non conference games against Maine, Hofstra, Sam Houston, and Cal Poly.

On paper it looks like the Griz should get a top 4 seed. But one thing that is working against the Griz is the committee might not give a seed to two teams in the same region. Mcneese State would be the first from the West region, as it stands right now. Our case is gonna have to be very strong to persuade the committee to give a second seed in the West region(lost to NDSU is not gonna help that at all.) I think our best chance it for McNeese State to lose at Nichols State this weekend. Although there is still a small possibilty for the Griz to get a top seed even if McNeese wins. Nonetheless I want the Cowboys to come to Washington-Grizzly Stadium so we can return a small favor we owe them. Go Nichols State!!!

People!!!! Trust me on this. If the Griz do as they are supposed to do this weekend, we will be fine. Be ready for football in Missoula in December.

TrueGriz said:

ronbo said:

....

Read this selection criteria.

3. The committee may give more consideration to those teams playing all Div. I opponents. Pretty straightforward, and the reason why I have been analyzing playoff fields with unmatched success for five years in the same manner. See the Sub-Div I (NS) column in the analyses below.

So, they count a loss as a loss. And they count a Div II game as a Div. II game. A loss counts the same no matter to who Div. I or Div. II. And a Div. II game counts the same whether you win it or lose it.

Example:

Montana 10-2 with one Div. II game.

Umass 10-2 with one NS game.

Western Kentucky 9-3 with two Div. II games.

The way I read it is that a Div. II game is weighted against you either way and the outcome isn't even in the equation except that it affects the overall win-loss record.

Your total win-loss record with Div. II and NS games considered for SOS.

Comments and thoughts?

Click to expand...

Now, where do you get that a div II win or loss counts the same whether you win or lose it?

Basically, a win against a div II team is as if a team didn't play any game at all. Loss will count big. The fewer division II or (NS) teams on the schedule and more div. I games the better the seeding. UMASS won their division II game, Griz didn't. UMASS should be seeded higher than Griz.
McNeese State did not play a division II or non-div I team, so naturally, McNeese State will be seeded higher.

Click to expand...

You copy and paste the criteria that says a loss to a Div II costs you bigtime.

It says NO SUCH THING.

You are making that up.

Div. II games are ONLY counted as a weakening of your SOS according to what I read. The penalty we get from the NDSU game is a loss on our record and a knock for playing a Div. II team.

Conversely do you notice you get NO EXTRA CREDIT for playing a Div 1A team? If you beat Oklahoma it counts as a win and is counted no better than if you beat Sac. State.

You guys are pissing off all the kitty fans in my office. They wanted me to let you know that it is arrogant to be talking about playoff seeding. I find it amusing to see how much of an after thought the kittys have become. I say a 4 seed with NAU making a trip up to Msla for a rematch. (and that my folks scares me.)

Jagur - NAU would not come here for a 1st round game. Teams from the same conference will not play each other in the 1st round.

I like to think that what grizpack is saying has merit. BH made a comment following the game last Sat. saying "we are right where we want to be" when asked about possible playoff seedings. Maybe the insiders know something we don't. IMHO, either way it doesn't matter. I smell Choo Choo in the Griz near future.

grizpack: I'm thinking NAU upset of McNeese. Than a trip to MSLA.

I believe that McNeese and Montana can both get a top 4 seed. Montana can get grouped with gateway schools just as well as Southland. There is nothing that says that the Big Sky and Southland have to me paired up.

McNeese State is gonna make the playoffs whether they win or lose. That is a given. In Tony Moss' Special Report II, dated 11/10/03 said that McNeese State is in the West Region...it said, " If the Grizzlies win out, they’ll have a shot at a top four, though McNeese State is also (with Montana)in the West region and the committee may not give two of the four seeds to one region." If they win, McNeese is gonna get the # 1 seed and make it tougher for Montana to get a top 4 seed, irregardless if the committee decideds to include the Gateway!!

The top four seeds are selected without regard to region. Regional pairings are made as best as can be done after the first four seeds are chosen.

Thus, the Griz do not have to be in the same bracket as McNeese. Should Montana be rated number 4 or better, they will not be penalized for being in the Western United States.

The committee will fill the brackets "regionally" based on who the top four teams are.

We shouldn't be sweating this; worrying about whether or not we're going to make it into the top 4 is a bigger concern, and I have a feeling (based on the GPI, not to mention how well the Griz have been playing in the last month) that even that is not that big of a concern.

Based, of course, on the Griz beating the 'Cats, which is obviously not a given.

Tony Moss, while an excellent guru of IAA football, has no solid info to base his ideas. He is not on the committee......and has as much ties to the committee as several posters on this site.

It is not as straight forward as the "Guidelines" would make it seem. What it comes down to is a lot of bickering between the committee members.

What would you argue if you were one of the committee members from a the conference that could have a top four seed if the Griz didn't......

You can be guaranteed that the NDSU loss will be brought up....and you can be guaranteed that it will carry more weight than a D1 loss. I know that would be my arguement if I was the Rep for the Gateway, and the committee was trying to decide if N.Iowa or the Griz should be #4.


On the other hand.....the Griz have a good case to be a top four seed. We are the Champ from the highest rated conference....our two losses are by mere pennies....#1 in the GPI.....in the top 4 in the Sportsnet poll...on a major roll right now (which I think weighs more heavily than we know) ....and we will put more butts in the seats, which brings more money (which they would never admit makes a bit of difference, but I'd wager it does behind closed committee doors.)


All of this is moot if we don't win this weekend. And that is where we should focus. Hogan is on the committee, so you know he will put a grand arguement on the table for the Griz. But we have no controll over where they will seed us....we only have control over winning this weekend .....then Sunday night we can say....see, I knew we would be a top 4.....or we can whine, man did we get screwed. Either way....all that matters is a win over the Pussies! :wink:

What were we seeded in '95? 6th? At best, one home game, maybe two if seedings played out? And what happened? Home games all the way to Marshall.......

How about '99? I want to say we were seeded 8th with a home game against Youngstown State. What happened? We lost by 3, but all top seeds on our side of the bracket lost - Youngstown State had home games the rest of the way-it coulda been us.

SO.....anything can happen - and personally, I'll worry about all that Saturday after 5 p.m. We have business to take care of prior to that.

Yes we need to win this Saturday. That's the key.

But all this talk of our seeding position is really pissing off the Cat fans! There isn't any other subject we could talk about that would PISS THEM OFF MORE.

We're in either way and their backs are against the wall. :lol: