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Back to Football - O-Line

SoldierGriz

Well-known member
DONOR
Where does this year's O-Line compare to the great O-lines in the past?

I know the Griz have potential gaps, or depth challenges at corner. They also have question marks at QB?

But, the O-line is the biggest question mark IMO. Why am I wrong?
 
SoldierGriz said:
Where does this year's O-Line compare to the great O-lines in the past?

I know the Griz have potential gaps, or depth challenges at corner. They also have question marks at QB?

But, the O-line is the biggest question mark IMO. Why am I wrong?

I've been stewing on an O-line post so Soldier I'm with ya man, let's talk some some football.

1. Where does this O-line compare to great OL's of the past? They don't. At least not yet. Of the group only Villanueva has meaningful time under his belt. The entire rest of the OL is painfully inexperienced and hardly played a meaningful snap last season. Does this mean the talent isn't there? No, not necessarily, however we're going to see this team breaking in 4 new starters and one of whom (Jackson) missed spring ball from surgery.

2. I'd say that both the OL and CB's share the same concern - 1 returning starter with real experience and a whole bunch of new faces after that.

What I like about this O-line

- Of the guys they're bringing in many were highly regarded recruits. Lots of 2 star and I think even a few 3 star guys.

- The starting group will (at first) presumably consist of mostly sophomores and 1 junior. All of whom have had 3 years with Germer and Nicholson. While the design of the offense will have changed, most of these guys have been together and worked together for years.

- As we all know Bobby & Rosy are bringing back the more traditional use of the fullback and tight end. This will help these guys immensely. They won't be out on their own as much, they'll have far more assistance in run blocking and edge protection than they would have seen with a Stitt-run offense meerly due to having more help from TEs/FBs.

- Bobby and company know how to bring the best out of the OL and he's got all of the right guys to help do the work. DOLA will really look like it should and I would suspect this OL will carry a meaner edge than we've seen in the last 8ish years.

- If these guys can get things going this year... look out. We'll have a solid corps of the same OL for 2-3 years. That could be huge.

My concerns

- As mentioned before, experience. Last year the 2nd team OL got very little reps and there wasn't much in terms of injuries that brought up the younger guys to play a game or two. They mostly did ST duty, which is nice... but leaves a big leap for transitioning to a starter role.

- OT depth. Right now we've got basically 3 viable OT's. Beaver, Jackson, and Keintz. The interior has a little more depth and more guys to move around, but OT really concerns me if we see bouts of injuries or ineffectiveness.

- Will guys that were recruited for a more fast-paced offense and looked at more as pass blockers be able to adapt to a system that's going to be far more balanced? If some of these guys aren't the right "fit" for this offense it may not matter how long they've been here or how highly thought of they were as HS recruits.
 
When I said recently to certain head coach, in the form of a statement/question, that I thought the o-line would be fine because they were big, athletic and numerous and hard Germer as their coach, he paused and then said: "They are just young."
 
PlayerRep said:
When I said recently to certain head coach, in the form of a statement/question, that I thought the o-line would be fine because they were big, athletic and numerous and hard Germer as their coach, he paused and then said: "They are just young."

I'm trying to figure how to take that. Is being young a bad thing if they have the talent?
 
Anyone know how Jackson is progressing?

I think he and Villanueva playing to their full potential is key.

Also, wish the Drake and uni game were switched to allow them to get a game under their belt.
 
SoldierGriz said:
Anyone know how Jackson is progressing?

I think he and Villanueva playing to their full potential is key.

Also, wish the Drake and uni game were switched to allow them to get a game under their belt.
Agreed, but here's some (small) silver linings: (1) Apparently -- based on items over there -- the UNI defense is relatively thin/inexperienced also. (They're talking a lot about the great talent they have coming in, but not so much about returning starters.) (2) While the Griz always need wins, the UNI game can be a "learning experience" (win or lose) ... and then the Drake game could provide a lower-risk chance to practice what they'll learned after a week of butt-chewing (if necessary).
 
PlayerRep said:
When I said recently to certain head coach, in the form of a statement/question, that I thought the o-line would be fine because they were big, athletic and numerous and hard Germer as their coach, he paused and then said: "They are just young."

Yes I think the issue with “young” is the game experience and learning curve. If everyone stays healthy, these guys will be a very solid bunch. Depth still needed, but the transfer tackle adds depth to that spot, so now maybe 4 guys there.
 
I’m not sure you’re going to see the pro set traditional offense on day one - not that the current QB’s couldn’t adapt, but the spread-option offense Rosey showed in the spring is tailor-made for them.

The adaptation was to Stitt’s strategy, inside zone & mostly pass blocking. All of them came from offenses they either ran spread option or power offenses, meaning they’ll be going back to something more like what they played in HS. Horrner & Bingham were defacto tight ends by year three because of trouble blocking edge rush schemes & getting outside backers blocked so they didn’t make the play from the backside in the running game.

O-linemen are pretty smart guys - they’ll adapt just fine. Depth is the issue & it will be interesting to see what they do to address that. With four new starters, getting them to work as a unit as quickly as possible is key.
 
bgbigdog said:
I’m not sure you’re going to see the pro set traditional offense on day one - not that the current QB’s couldn’t adapt, but the spread-option offense Rosey showed in the spring is tailor-made for them.
I think BH and TM are wed to what they call the "Power Spread," pretty much what was used at SDSU. If only we had a RB like SDSU had....
 
BWahlberg said:
SoldierGriz said:
Where does this year's O-Line compare to the great O-lines in the past?

I know the Griz have potential gaps, or depth challenges at corner. They also have question marks at QB?

But, the O-line is the biggest question mark IMO. Why am I wrong?

I've been stewing on an O-line post so Soldier I'm with ya man, let's talk some some football.

1. Where does this O-line compare to great OL's of the past? They don't. At least not yet. Of the group only Villanueva has meaningful time under his belt. The entire rest of the OL is painfully inexperienced and hardly played a meaningful snap last season. Does this mean the talent isn't there? No, not necessarily, however we're going to see this team breaking in 4 new starters and one of whom (Jackson) missed spring ball from surgery.

2. I'd say that both the OL and CB's share the same concern - 1 returning starter with real experience and a whole bunch of new faces after that.

What I like about this O-line

- Of the guys they're bringing in many were highly regarded recruits. Lots of 2 star and I think even a few 3 star guys.

- The starting group will (at first) presumably consist of mostly sophomores and 1 junior. All of whom have had 3 years with Germer and Nicholson. While the design of the offense will have changed, most of these guys have been together and worked together for years.

- As we all know Bobby & Rosy are bringing back the more traditional use of the fullback and tight end. This will help these guys immensely. They won't be out on their own as much, they'll have far more assistance in run blocking and edge protection than they would have seen with a Stitt-run offense meerly due to having more help from TEs/FBs.

- Bobby and company know how to bring the best out of the OL and he's got all of the right guys to help do the work. DOLA will really look like it should and I would suspect this OL will carry a meaner edge than we've seen in the last 8ish years.

- If these guys can get things going this year... look out. We'll have a solid corps of the same OL for 2-3 years. That could be huge.

My concerns

- As mentioned before, experience. Last year the 2nd team OL got very little reps and there wasn't much in terms of injuries that brought up the younger guys to play a game or two. They mostly did ST duty, which is nice... but leaves a big leap for transitioning to a starter role.

- OT depth. Right now we've got basically 3 viable OT's. Beaver, Jackson, and Keintz. The interior has a little more depth and more guys to move around, but OT really concerns me if we see bouts of injuries or ineffectiveness.

- Will guys that were recruited for a more fast-paced offense and looked at more as pass blockers be able to adapt to a system that's going to be far more balanced? If some of these guys aren't the right "fit" for this offense it may not matter how long they've been here or how highly thought of they were as HS recruits.

My hope that the young O-linemen have the agility and speed to do things other than zone block. I hope our running game uses traps, and having the linemen out on the periphery blocked on sweeps.
 
i think what b/h meant by young is game experience and ability to adjust on every play.....ie. during game, the defense runs a double stack blitz in the A gap or a all out blitz by l/b or safety....the adjustment that should be called is the o/l blocks down in zone.....it only takes one guy,to not recognize this is what needs to be done.....if you have an experienced center that recognizes this, they may have a one word call that changes to that blocking scheme.....this may not be clear but i tried to give an example of all the crazy stuff that is going on in a split second... adjustments......there really is no substitute for experience, no matter how talented the player may be....
 
Yukon said:
PlayerRep said:
When I said recently to certain head coach, in the form of a statement/question, that I thought the o-line would be fine because they were big, athletic and numerous and hard Germer as their coach, he paused and then said: "They are just young."

I'm trying to figure how to take that. Is being young a bad thing if they have the talent?

I think its Bobbys way of saying, dont worry too much, I've seen this scenario many times before, and that they will be just fine, and grow into a strong unit.

I think its his way of saying..dont worry, cuz hes not.
 
To me it seems, the job of OLine men is to get as big and strong as possible. Then that makes it easier for you to push around the smaller opponent. I like the size of most of the guys again. There was a long period where our line did not average over 305. I think when Bobby was here before, his lines always averaged 325+. I think our line this years and for the near future will be just fine.
 
reinell30 said:
To me it seems, the job of OLine men is to get as big and strong as possible. Then that makes it easier for you to push around the smaller opponent. I like the size of most of the guys again. There was a long period where our line did not average over 305. I think when Bobby was here before, his lines always averaged 325+. I think our line this years and for the near future will be just fine.

I cannot recall a season when the GRIZ averaged 325 lbs. It is hard to find a good quality NFL Line that averages 325. The GRIZ are just fine at 295+ average. 300 is a nice a number though.
 
mtgrizrule said:
reinell30 said:
To me it seems, the job of OLine men is to get as big and strong as possible. Then that makes it easier for you to push around the smaller opponent. I like the size of most of the guys again. There was a long period where our line did not average over 305. I think when Bobby was here before, his lines always averaged 325+. I think our line this years and for the near future will be just fine.

I cannot recall a season when the GRIZ averaged 325 lbs. It is hard to find a good quality NFL Line that averages 325. The GRIZ are just fine at 295+ average. 300 is a nice a number though.


Agreed. Give me a 290 lb. O-lineman with good footwork, quickness, and the ability to run and I'll take him every day over a 325 lb. behemoth who can't get out of his own way. Yes, there are 325 lb. linemen in college football who can also move...... but they play at the FBS level.
 
4theluvofgriz said:
mtgrizrule said:
reinell30 said:
To me it seems, the job of OLine men is to get as big and strong as possible. Then that makes it easier for you to push around the smaller opponent. I like the size of most of the guys again. There was a long period where our line did not average over 305. I think when Bobby was here before, his lines always averaged 325+. I think our line this years and for the near future will be just fine.

I cannot recall a season when the GRIZ averaged 325 lbs. It is hard to find a good quality NFL Line that averages 325. The GRIZ are just fine at 295+ average. 300 is a nice a number though.


Agreed. Give me a 290 lb. O-lineman with good footwork, quickness, and the ability to run and I'll take him every day over a 325 lb. behemoth who can't get out of his own way. Yes, there are 325 lb. linemen in college football who can also move...... but they play at the FBS level.


Will Pheohls, Levi Horn, Danny Kistler, just a few that played for bobby and were all over 325. I think if you look at the starting O-Line for Bobby in 2008-09 all were over 325. I am just going off memory.
 
reinell30 said:
4theluvofgriz said:
mtgrizrule said:
reinell30 said:
To me it seems, the job of OLine men is to get as big and strong as possible. Then that makes it easier for you to push around the smaller opponent. I like the size of most of the guys again. There was a long period where our line did not average over 305. I think when Bobby was here before, his lines always averaged 325+. I think our line this years and for the near future will be just fine.

I cannot recall a season when the GRIZ averaged 325 lbs. It is hard to find a good quality NFL Line that averages 325. The GRIZ are just fine at 295+ average. 300 is a nice a number though.


Agreed. Give me a 290 lb. O-lineman with good footwork, quickness, and the ability to run and I'll take him every day over a 325 lb. behemoth who can't get out of his own way. Yes, there are 325 lb. linemen in college football who can also move...... but they play at the FBS level.


Will Pheohls, Levi Horn, Danny Kistler, just a few that played for bobby and were all over 325. I think if you look at the starting O-Line for Bobby in 2008-09 all were over 325. I am just going off memory.


I think the roster would disagree with you.

61 Jake Raynock Fr. OG 6-2 255 Billings, Mont. / Skyview HS
66 Russell Piette Jr. OG 6-4 310 Vancouver, WAsh. /
74 Jon Opperud So. OG 6-7 305 Portland, Ore. / Milwaukie HS
77 Terran Hillesland Sr. OG 6-7 323 Sidney, Mont. / Sidney HS
57 Charles Burton So. OL 6-5 315 Long Beach, Calif. / Milikan HS
TBD Kyle Hofmann Fr. OL 6-4 280 Orcas Island, Wash. / Orcas Island HS
72 Levi Horn Sr. OT 6-7 315 Spokane, Wash. / Rogers HS
 
codycleve said:
reinell30 said:
4theluvofgriz said:
mtgrizrule said:



I cannot recall a season when the GRIZ averaged 325 lbs. It is hard to find a good quality NFL Line that averages 325. The GRIZ are just fine at 295+ average. 300 is a nice a number though.


Agreed. Give me a 290 lb. O-lineman with good footwork, quickness, and the ability to run and I'll take him every day over a 325 lb. behemoth who can't get out of his own way. Yes, there are 325 lb. linemen in college football who can also move...... but they play at the FBS level.


Will Pheohls, Levi Horn, Danny Kistler, just a few that played for bobby and were all over 325. I think if you look at the starting O-Line for Bobby in 2008-09 all were over 325. I am just going off memory.


I think the roster would disagree with you.

61 Jake Raynock Fr. OG 6-2 255 Billings, Mont. / Skyview HS
66 Russell Piette Jr. OG 6-4 310 Vancouver, WAsh. /
74 Jon Opperud So. OG 6-7 305 Portland, Ore. / Milwaukie HS
77 Terran Hillesland Sr. OG 6-7 323 Sidney, Mont. / Sidney HS
57 Charles Burton So. OL 6-5 315 Long Beach, Calif. / Milikan HS
TBD Kyle Hofmann Fr. OL 6-4 280 Orcas Island, Wash. / Orcas Island HS
72 Levi Horn Sr. OT 6-7 315 Spokane, Wash. / Rogers HS


And you sir are correct! I stand corrected! That it what I get for trying to follow my memory, I should have looked it up 1st. I looked at past rosters and found that only Danny Kistler was 335 and Will Phoels was only 315 in 2010 and Bobby was gone.
 
Offensive line cohesiveness and attitude make all the difference.Yes, size is important, but there is much more between the ears that make an offensive line a "good" offensive line.
 
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