Just when

Grizzly Basketball and Big Sky Conference Hoops
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UMGriz75
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Re: Just when

Post by UMGriz75 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:52 am

griznative24 wrote:Good post and this is true, but I would like to add the the UofM does absolutely nothing to promote its hoops squad. I go to school here, and there is an absence of knowledge across campus that the school even has basketball teams. There is no promotion for home games. Their social media accounts are lacking in posts and highlights. No tailgating/festivities. And a soundtrack that's made up mostly of Jock Jams from 1993. Because of all this the student section looks like a lifeless mob (xanax could be a problem here, too). Put a little effort here and there and I bet that attendance would go up.
I've mentioned this several times, according to some, "innumerable" times. At OSU, Tinks got out on campus and did promotion himself; attendance up 45-50%.

At UM, varsity does little campus promotion. Football kind of takes care of itself by sheer presence and history, but on campus, Stitt has very little interaction. He's not made himself a part of the campus community for whatever reasons. Travis, I would have thought, would do things somewhat differently, but then Haslam cut his promotional budget in half this year. Very little "campus presence." And yes, the games are presented the same as 40 years ago.

And no beer.
BadlandsGrizFan » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:40 pm
1. Griz- We got another year under Stitt's system, hes got HIS guy at D coordinator. Talented roster, lots of battle tested kids returning.

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Re: Just when

Post by sacstateman » Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:55 am

EverettGriz wrote:
sacstateman wrote:We may have only had 859 on average but that is 85% of capacity...not bad...probably the best percentage of capacity in the BSC...
So, what you're saying is that my shitter, with a capacity of one, outdraws sac?
I didn't expect anything more from you...and I didn't say we outdraw anyone...I know reading comprehension is one of your major gripes with other posters, maybe you should brush up on your abilities....

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Re: Just when

Post by '68griz » Tue Jan 10, 2017 10:12 am

griznative24 wrote:
Bengal visitor wrote:The Big Sky was 20th in the nation among 32 D-1 conferences last year. Not great, but not horrible. Bottom line is that college basketball, outside the P-5 and a few hot spots like Gonzaga (whose arena only seats 6,000, but is filled every night) is a declining commodity. Far too much hoops on television, and declining interest among students and younger fans. The Montana schools are not immune to this trend -- their attendance has been steadily declining over the past two decades, as has attendance at most Big Sky schools.

I know Everett's response will be, "Well if we could just get out of this lousy conference, we'd draw much better." Of course you would. But until that happens, this is your reality.
Good post and this is true, but I would like to add the the UofM does absolutely nothing to promote its hoops squad. I go to school here, and there is an absence of knowledge across campus that the school even has basketball teams. There is no promotion for home games. Their social media accounts are lacking in posts and highlights. No tailgating/festivities. And a soundtrack that's made up mostly of Jock Jams from 1993. Because of all this the student section looks like a lifeless mob (xanax could be a problem here, too). Put a little effort here and there and I bet that attendance would go up.
I actually got a post this morning, promoting the two games later this week. Believe that's a first.

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Re: Just when

Post by GrizLA » Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:26 pm

UMGriz75 wrote:
griznative24 wrote:Good post and this is true, but I would like to add the the UofM does absolutely nothing to promote its hoops squad. I go to school here, and there is an absence of knowledge across campus that the school even has basketball teams. There is no promotion for home games. Their social media accounts are lacking in posts and highlights. No tailgating/festivities. And a soundtrack that's made up mostly of Jock Jams from 1993. Because of all this the student section looks like a lifeless mob (xanax could be a problem here, too). Put a little effort here and there and I bet that attendance would go up.
I've mentioned this several times, according to some, "innumerable" times. At OSU, Tinks got out on campus and did promotion himself; attendance up 45-50%.

At UM, varsity does little campus promotion. Football kind of takes care of itself by sheer presence and history, but on campus, Stitt has very little interaction. He's not made himself a part of the campus community for whatever reasons. Travis, I would have thought, would do things somewhat differently, but then Haslam cut his promotional budget in half this year. Very little "campus presence." And yes, the games are presented the same as 40 years ago.

And no beer.
Are you even capable of posting on egriz without some sort of negative remark directed toward the football coach? Winning games, as many college administrators will admit, will increase attendance. UCLA is now selling out when just a mere three years ago they could not, even in a smaller Pavilion. Let it, go, 75, Stitt is in your head night and day. He seemingly owns you. I used to admire your writing and quick analysis, but no more. Just one more to skip over.

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Re: Just when

Post by Proud Griz Man » Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:54 pm

EverettGriz wrote:
sacstateman wrote:We may have only had 859 on average but that is 85% of capacity...not bad...probably the best percentage of capacity in the BSC...
So, what you're saying is that my shitter, with a capacity of one, outdraws sac?
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Re: Just when

Post by UMGriz75 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:32 pm

GrizLA wrote:
UMGriz75 wrote:
griznative24 wrote:Good post and this is true, but I would like to add the the UofM does absolutely nothing to promote its hoops squad. I go to school here, and there is an absence of knowledge across campus that the school even has basketball teams. There is no promotion for home games. Their social media accounts are lacking in posts and highlights. No tailgating/festivities. And a soundtrack that's made up mostly of Jock Jams from 1993. Because of all this the student section looks like a lifeless mob (xanax could be a problem here, too). Put a little effort here and there and I bet that attendance would go up.
I've mentioned this several times, according to some, "innumerable" times. At OSU, Tinks got out on campus and did promotion himself; attendance up 45-50%.

At UM, varsity does little campus promotion. Football kind of takes care of itself by sheer presence and history, but on campus, Stitt has very little interaction. He's not made himself a part of the campus community for whatever reasons. Travis, I would have thought, would do things somewhat differently, but then Haslam cut his promotional budget in half this year. Very little "campus presence." And yes, the games are presented the same as 40 years ago.

And no beer.
Are you even capable of posting on egriz without some sort of negative remark directed toward the football coach? Winning games, as many college administrators will admit, will increase attendance. UCLA is now selling out when just a mere three years ago they could not, even in a smaller Pavilion. Let it, go, 75, Stitt is in your head night and day. He seemingly owns you. I used to admire your writing and quick analysis, but no more. Just one more to skip over.
\He hardly owns me. I feel sorry for the guy. A lot of people set him up with a lot of hot air for a long fall down. Like Engstrom, he must feel way over his head. I know for a fact what the "firestorm" was like after the Griz-Cat Game from parents donors fans and players, and it was not pretty. If he already knew what to do, he would've done it. He couldn't. Stitt is in something of an impossible position. As I have said, I think he is a "sunk" cost, and I suspect he may realize as much.

It's simply a fact. It ties in with my broader criticisms of how the Athletic Department [doesn't] promote the sports on campus. You'd think football, the biggest, would be a good exemplar given that it actually has been popular with the students in the recent past; a made-for-success model for campus interaction and promotion, and one that the other "lesser" sports might be able to tie their wagons to.

But, unlike Delaney, Stitt just isn't part of it. I don't really care that you think I'm "on Stitt." It's the biggest sport program and, especially given Basketball's budget cut for promotion, the Elephant. I like to see sports "engage" the campus community, in turn because that generates supportive alumni when the kids graduate.

Like Engstrom, it's absurd to say "let go" of a major influence on campus or on sports. It's absurd. I brought it up because 1) it's germane to the presence of varsity sports in the student community and 2) it's true.

You object because you don't like criticism of "Stitt." Like Engstrom, who was a super-nice guy, people legitimately committed to the success of this institution needed to separate petty loyalties from institutional needs. Engstrom stayed far too long -- in large part because of people like you who didn't "want to hear about it."

People like you don't support programs, you help destroy them by inane appeals to loyalty and "shut up" about serious problems. I didn't have to merely predict, to a barrage of hatemail, where I thought football was headed this year. It happened. And you hate that and you hate the fact that someone called it, and it wasn't you. I am sure your good judgment will continue to guide you: don't pay any attention to anyone who actually got it right, with Engstrom or with Stitt or, for that matter, about JJ and that fiasco.

I think Travis is a great coach, but BB is missing something with the students. Stitt doesn't care because he doesn't need it. But it isn't because Bob Stitt lifts a finger. He doesn't "seem interested" and while some players have offered suggestions as to "why," -- and they are interesting reasons -- it doesn't do any good to discuss them on egriz; all it does is inflame the sniffer crowd.

But, if there were a more active campus/student presence, I also think it would have at least a spillover effect for BB. In part because FB got the promotional budget for it, and BB lost half of its budget to the FB budget. So, yes, the "attitude" is part of what is frustrating because of that indirect effect on BB (and the other varsity sports as well). If Stitt's not interested, the concern is that it closes budget doors to on-campus promotional efforts for BB and everyone else.

I have a different perspective than you, or most, egrizzers. And I have specific reasons for those perspectives and it's based on a long experience here. Campus varsity sports can have a synergistic effect on student participation and enthusiasm. Although students are pretty down on FB after this past season, I was also disheartened to see the Kaimin commenting that most students didn't care; they didn't care about the Griz-Cat game. That's part of that campus "social networking" I have referred to. And it also relates to "tipping points" in program development, and the feeling that one is coming for football, represented in some part by student attitudes which are dramatically changing according to the Kaimin.

It's ahead of non-student opinion, and its a better resource than you (generically). I'd like to see BB benefiting from the synergy, but unfortunately and in large part because FB got more of the budget for it this year, FB is also paying no attention to developing student interest. Stitt's just not interested, and the students are beginning to respond to that. So, how to promote BB against that tide and with FB getting the budget support for that kind of development but refusing to do it on campus?

Well, you represent the know-it-alls that predicted a great past FB season: playoffs for sure! If students are beginning to fall away from the varsity sports, but you don't want Stitt even mentioned, aren't you part of the problem here? How does BB, then, "go it alone?"

UM has the makings of a "great" program here for Basketball. I am talking since Heathcote days, including when beating Gonzaga and Adrian Buonchristiani was a special season privilege. And seeing the students as a big part of that isn't just because "it's nice," its because it puts UM a whole level ahead of BSC if the students participate as they used to, and can, and for recruiting as well.

Contrary to the football threads, where lugubrious and ridiculous people are arguing that "success" isn't a recruiting tool, it is the very best recruiting tool, and team success and strong student support are hand-in-hand to the appearance and the achievement of success.

Done well, "Our House" can mean Dahlberg Arena.
BadlandsGrizFan » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:40 pm
1. Griz- We got another year under Stitt's system, hes got HIS guy at D coordinator. Talented roster, lots of battle tested kids returning.

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Re: Just when

Post by Mavman » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:44 pm

So Stitt refuses to go out and beg students to come to basketball games? Is that what you are saying?
AKA nevada griz

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Re: Just when

Post by UMGriz75 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:34 pm

Mavman wrote:So Stitt refuses to go out and beg students to come to basketball games? Is that what you are saying?
Yeah. Take it to the bank.
BadlandsGrizFan » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:40 pm
1. Griz- We got another year under Stitt's system, hes got HIS guy at D coordinator. Talented roster, lots of battle tested kids returning.

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Re: Just when

Post by GrizLA » Tue Jan 10, 2017 10:27 pm

UMGriz75 wrote:
GrizLA wrote:
UMGriz75 wrote:
griznative24 wrote:Good post and this is true, but I would like to add the the UofM does absolutely nothing to promote its hoops squad. I go to school here, and there is an absence of knowledge across campus that the school even has basketball teams. There is no promotion for home games. Their social media accounts are lacking in posts and highlights. No tailgating/festivities. And a soundtrack that's made up mostly of Jock Jams from 1993. Because of all this the student section looks like a lifeless mob (xanax could be a problem here, too). Put a little effort here and there and I bet that attendance would go up.
I've mentioned this several times, according to some, "innumerable" times. At OSU, Tinks got out on campus and did promotion himself; attendance up 45-50%.

At UM, varsity does little campus promotion. Football kind of takes care of itself by sheer presence and history, but on campus, Stitt has very little interaction. He's not made himself a part of the campus community for whatever reasons. Travis, I would have thought, would do things somewhat differently, but then Haslam cut his promotional budget in half this year. Very little "campus presence." And yes, the games are presented the same as 40 years ago.

And no beer.
Are you even capable of posting on egriz without some sort of negative remark directed toward the football coach? Winning games, as many college administrators will admit, will increase attendance. UCLA is now selling out when just a mere three years ago they could not, even in a smaller Pavilion. Let it, go, 75, Stitt is in your head night and day. He seemingly owns you. I used to admire your writing and quick analysis, but no more. Just one more to skip over.
\He hardly owns me. I feel sorry for the guy. A lot of people set him up with a lot of hot air for a long fall down. Like Engstrom, he must feel way over his head. I know for a fact what the "firestorm" was like after the Griz-Cat Game from parents donors fans and players, and it was not pretty. If he already knew what to do, he would've done it. He couldn't. Stitt is in something of an impossible position. As I have said, I think he is a "sunk" cost, and I suspect he may realize as much.

It's simply a fact. It ties in with my broader criticisms of how the Athletic Department [doesn't] promote the sports on campus. You'd think football, the biggest, would be a good exemplar given that it actually has been popular with the students in the recent past; a made-for-success model for campus interaction and promotion, and one that the other "lesser" sports might be able to tie their wagons to.

But, unlike Delaney, Stitt just isn't part of it. I don't really care that you think I'm "on Stitt." It's the biggest sport program and, especially given Basketball's budget cut for promotion, the Elephant. I like to see sports "engage" the campus community, in turn because that generates supportive alumni when the kids graduate.

Like Engstrom, it's absurd to say "let go" of a major influence on campus or on sports. It's absurd. I brought it up because 1) it's germane to the presence of varsity sports in the student community and 2) it's true.

You object because you don't like criticism of "Stitt." Like Engstrom, who was a super-nice guy, people legitimately committed to the success of this institution needed to separate petty loyalties from institutional needs. Engstrom stayed far too long -- in large part because of people like you who didn't "want to hear about it."

People like you don't support programs, you help destroy them by inane appeals to loyalty and "shut up" about serious problems. I didn't have to merely predict, to a barrage of hatemail, where I thought football was headed this year. It happened. And you hate that and you hate the fact that someone called it, and it wasn't you. I am sure your good judgment will continue to guide you: don't pay any attention to anyone who actually got it right, with Engstrom or with Stitt or, for that matter, about JJ and that fiasco.

I think Travis is a great coach, but BB is missing something with the students. Stitt doesn't care because he doesn't need it. But it isn't because Bob Stitt lifts a finger. He doesn't "seem interested" and while some players have offered suggestions as to "why," -- and they are interesting reasons -- it doesn't do any good to discuss them on egriz; all it does is inflame the sniffer crowd.

But, if there were a more active campus/student presence, I also think it would have at least a spillover effect for BB. In part because FB got the promotional budget for it, and BB lost half of its budget to the FB budget. So, yes, the "attitude" is part of what is frustrating because of that indirect effect on BB (and the other varsity sports as well). If Stitt's not interested, the concern is that it closes budget doors to on-campus promotional efforts for BB and everyone else.

I have a different perspective than you, or most, egrizzers. And I have specific reasons for those perspectives and it's based on a long experience here. Campus varsity sports can have a synergistic effect on student participation and enthusiasm. Although students are pretty down on FB after this past season, I was also disheartened to see the Kaimin commenting that most students didn't care; they didn't care about the Griz-Cat game. That's part of that campus "social networking" I have referred to. And it also relates to "tipping points" in program development, and the feeling that one is coming for football, represented in some part by student attitudes which are dramatically changing according to the Kaimin.

It's ahead of non-student opinion, and its a better resource than you (generically). I'd like to see BB benefiting from the synergy, but unfortunately and in large part because FB got more of the budget for it this year, FB is also paying no attention to developing student interest. Stitt's just not interested, and the students are beginning to respond to that. So, how to promote BB against that tide and with FB getting the budget support for that kind of development but refusing to do it on campus?

Well, you represent the know-it-alls that predicted a great past FB season: playoffs for sure! If students are beginning to fall away from the varsity sports, but you don't want Stitt even mentioned, aren't you part of the problem here? How does BB, then, "go it alone?"

UM has the makings of a "great" program here for Basketball. I am talking since Heathcote days, including when beating Gonzaga and Adrian Buonchristiani was a special season privilege. And seeing the students as a big part of that isn't just because "it's nice," its because it puts UM a whole level ahead of BSC if the students participate as they used to, and can, and for recruiting as well.

Contrary to the football threads, where lugubrious and ridiculous people are arguing that "success" isn't a recruiting tool, it is the very best recruiting tool, and team success and strong student support are hand-in-hand to the appearance and the achievement of success.

Done well, "Our House" can mean Dahlberg Arena.
You don't know people like me because we are the people who produce something besides anger and bitterness. You need to get out more. Stitt is your obsession. Not ours.

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Re: Just when

Post by Zirg » Tue Jan 10, 2017 10:59 pm

Proud Griz Man wrote:
EverettGriz wrote:Total attendance at the Sac PSU game: 211
TWO HUNDRED ELEVEN!!!!!!!
Shit, at lesst 190 of those were drunken homeless looking for a place to get warm.
211.....
It is not just the BSC - fact.

http://www.portlandpilots.com/boxscore. ... ll&id=8281
Cal State Fullerton 77 over U of Portland 72 in overtime.
Date 12/22/16 Time 7:30 p.m. Attendance: 673
Site: Titan Gym (Fullerton, Calif.)
Referees Frank Harvey, Donn Berdahl, Levon Zakarian


http://www.portlandpilots.com/boxscore. ... ll&id=8283
U of Portland 73 over Pepperdine 60.
Date 12/31/16 Time 5:00 PM Attendance: 1624
Site: Portland, Ore. (Chiles Center)
Referees Michael Greenstein, Deldre Carr, Dennis Flannery
all I noticed was the referee:DELDRE CARR-former Griz b-ball1er

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Re: Just when

Post by UMGriz75 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:01 am

GrizLA wrote:
UMGriz75 wrote: Done well, "Our House" can mean Dahlberg Arena.
You don't know people like me because we are the people who produce something besides anger and bitterness. You need to get out more. Stitt is your obsession. Not ours.
I'd say you're obsessed with finding an "obsession." It may be baffling to you to find a lead coach talked about on a sports forum, but if you find it strange or obsessive, perhaps you need to step back and look where you are typing.

This thread is a good example. A remark about Stitt, consisting of a couple of sentences in a completely appropriate context of the University of Montana and building a sports presence on campus, brought an eruption out of you. I'd say, if you have a hair trigger that sensitive, "obsession" isn't a word strong enough. After all, when you gather yourself back together, how DO you have a rational discussion about building a sport presence among students WITHOUT discussing the lead coach with the biggest budget? Frankly, it's idiotic in this context to be jumping up and down shouting "SEE! SEE! HE MENTIONED STITT AGAIN!!" If you can discuss the topic rationally -- promoting sports on campus -- and do so without mentioning the head coaches, their respective budgets and why it isn't working on this campus, you must be a gd genius or at least think you are.

Royce Engstrom did a tremendous harm to this University. The "anger and bitterness" was justified, and what I expressed on these forums was well shared by the campus community, despite the efforts of his "supporters" including those on these forums, to paint his critics as "angry and bitter." Even "obsessed." Well, we've resolved that difference of opinion, haven't we? It took a gdam giant hole in the ground to convince people like you that "critics" are sometimes right, and well-placed critics most often so. And personally, I like Engstrom. I like Stitt.

However, like Engstrom, Stitt is a major influence on the direction of the campus and obviously of the sport programs. You're not involved on campus, you don't see those directions on a daily basis and where they are going, you're not talking to the kids and staff on a daily basis, so maybe the best advice is, if you can't handle the commentary about building a sports presence on campus, or simply don't know a dam thing about it, butt out and go relax.
BadlandsGrizFan » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:40 pm
1. Griz- We got another year under Stitt's system, hes got HIS guy at D coordinator. Talented roster, lots of battle tested kids returning.

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Re: Just when

Post by siouxfan512 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:31 pm

WILDCATFAN wrote:
Proud Griz Man wrote:
EverettGriz wrote:Total attendance at the Sac PSU game: 211
TWO HUNDRED ELEVEN!!!!!!!
Shit, at lesst 190 of those were drunken homeless looking for a place to get warm.
211.....
It is not just the BSC - fact.

http://www.portlandpilots.com/boxscore. ... ll&id=8281
Cal State Fullerton 77 over U of Portland 72 in overtime.
Date 12/22/16 Time 7:30 p.m. Attendance: 673
Site: Titan Gym (Fullerton, Calif.)
Referees Frank Harvey, Donn Berdahl, Levon Zakarian


http://www.portlandpilots.com/boxscore. ... ll&id=8283
U of Portland 73 over Pepperdine 60.
Date 12/31/16 Time 5:00 PM Attendance: 1624
Site: Portland, Ore. (Chiles Center)
Referees Michael Greenstein, Deldre Carr, Dennis Flannery


It's not just the Big Sky, Basketball attendance is low pretty much everywhere in the West.

This is a list I made at the end of the season last year with stats from NCAA.com. Every team from a western conference's attendance
62 Western Conferences Attendance Standings from highest to lowest for all Pac 12, WCC, Big Sky, Big West, Mountain West and WAC teams. (Not Sure where the article got the 14th highest out west for Weber, according to NCAA.com, Weber has the 13th highest average)

Ranking- school- average- conference

Schools in top 100

1. BYU - 14,699- West Coast
2. Arizona- 14,526- Pac 12
3. New Mexico- 13,030- Mountain West
4. Utah- 12,997- Pac 12
5. San Diego State- 12,209- Mountain West
6. UNLV- 11,542- Mountain West
7. California- 10,182- Pac 12
8. Utah State- 8,874- Mountain West
9. Colorado- 8,540- Pac 12
10. UCLA- 8,073- Pac 12
11. Oregon- 7,466- Pac 12
12. Hawaii- 7,081- Big West
13. Weber State- 6,785- Big Sky
14. Washington- 6,784- Pac 12
15. Nevada- 6,554- Mountain West
16. Fresno State- 6,296- Mountain West
17. Boise State- 6,270- Mountain West
18. Oregon State- 6,256- Pac 12
19. Gonzaga- 6,000- West Coast
20. Arizona State- 5,806- Pac 12
21. Grand Canyon- 5,805- WAC
22. Wyoming- 5,481- Mountain West

Schools not in top 100

23. New Mexico State- 4,767- WAC
24. USC- 4,606- Pac 12
25. Stanford- 4,393- Pac 12
26. Montana- 3,955- Big Sky
27. Colorado State- 3,853- Mountain West
28. Long Beach State- 3,215- Big West
29. UC Irvine- 2,978- Big West
30. Washington State- 2,856- Pac 12
31. St. Mary's- 2,611- West Coast
32. Montana State- 2,502- Big Sky
33. Pacific- 2,406- West Coast
34. Portland- 2,385- West Coast
35. Utah Valley- 2,383- WAC
36. UC Santa Barbara- 2,362- Big West
37. Cal Poly- 2,309- Big West
38. Loyola Marymount- 2,221- West Coast
39. UC Davis- 2,111- West Coast

40. San Diego- 1,986- West Coast
41. North Dakota- 1,850- Big Sky
42. Idaho State- 1,836- Big Sky
43. Santa Clara- 1,763- West Coast
44. Eastern Washington- 1,747- Big Sky
45. Southern Utah- 1,695- Big Sky
46. Seattle- 1,675- WAC
47. Cal State Bakersfield- 1,657- WAC
48. San Jose State- 1,647- Mountain West
49. Pepperdine- 1,572- West Coast
50. Missouri Kansas City- 1,528- WAC
51. San Francisco- 1,524- West Coast
52. Air Force- 1,476- Mountain West
53. Idaho- 1,400- Big Sky
54. Northern Colorado- 1,247- Big Sky
55. Northern Arizona- 1,235- Big Sky
56. Texas Rio Grande Valley- 1,134- WAC
57. Cal St. Northridge- 1,132- Big West
58. Chicago State- 1,091- WAC
59. Cal St. Fullerton- 1,077- Big West
60. Sacramento State- 859- Big Sky
61. UC Riverside- 841- Big West
62. Portland State- 662- Big Sky (Portland State had the 11th worst average in D1 hoops)
http://bigskyfans.com/wildcats/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5341


23 teams had attendance averages last year under 2,000

9 BSC
4 WCC
5 WAC
2 MWC
3 BWC
As a UND fan, it is frustrating to watch. We get almost 12,000 on average for hockey (which is great), but struggle to get 2,000 to basketball (in a season where we should be very competitive).

Would like to see more fans, but I do like that our football coach has been pushing support for the basketball team. He is usually at the games, and last season we started seeing a good chunk of the football team at the games getting rowdy and getting the crowd into. Always nice to see different athletic teams supporting each other.

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Re: Just when

Post by Zirg » Mon Jan 16, 2017 12:37 am

EverettGriz wrote:Total attendance at the Sac PSU game: 211


TWO HUNDRED ELEVEN!!!!!!!

Shit, at lesst 190 of those were drunken homeless looking for a place to get warm.



211.....
211 IS pathetic for any D1 mens b-ball program, but at least they are (presumably) reporting honest figures, which is commendable, and rare.

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Re: Just when

Post by EverettGriz » Mon Jan 16, 2017 1:03 am

Zirg wrote:
EverettGriz wrote:Total attendance at the Sac PSU game: 211


TWO HUNDRED ELEVEN!!!!!!!

Shit, at lesst 190 of those were drunken homeless looking for a place to get warm.



211.....
211 IS pathetic for any D1 mens b-ball program, but at least they are (presumably) reporting honest figures, which is commendable, and rare.
Well, they kinda have to. Because with 211 people there, anyone in the stands could count the attendance twice during a media timeout.
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ordigger
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Re: Just when

Post by ordigger » Mon Jan 16, 2017 6:20 am

UMGriz75 wrote:
GrizLA wrote:
UMGriz75 wrote:
griznative24 wrote:Good post and this is true, but I would like to add the the UofM does absolutely nothing to promote its hoops squad. I go to school here, and there is an absence of knowledge across campus that the school even has basketball teams. There is no promotion for home games. Their social media accounts are lacking in posts and highlights. No tailgating/festivities. And a soundtrack that's made up mostly of Jock Jams from 1993. Because of all this the student section looks like a lifeless mob (xanax could be a problem here, too). Put a little effort here and there and I bet that attendance would go up.
I've mentioned this several times, according to some, "innumerable" times. At OSU, Tinks got out on campus and did promotion himself; attendance up 45-50%.

At UM, varsity does little campus promotion. Football kind of takes care of itself by sheer presence and history, but on campus, Stitt has very little interaction. He's not made himself a part of the campus community for whatever reasons. Travis, I would have thought, would do things somewhat differently, but then Haslam cut his promotional budget in half this year. Very little "campus presence." And yes, the games are presented the same as 40 years ago.

And no beer.
Are you even capable of posting on egriz without some sort of negative remark directed toward the football coach? Winning games, as many college administrators will admit, will increase attendance. UCLA is now selling out when just a mere three years ago they could not, even in a smaller Pavilion. Let it, go, 75, Stitt is in your head night and day. He seemingly owns you. I used to admire your writing and quick analysis, but no more. Just one more to skip over.
\He hardly owns me. I feel sorry for the guy. A lot of people set him up with a lot of hot air for a long fall down. Like Engstrom, he must feel way over his head. I know for a fact what the "firestorm" was like after the Griz-Cat Game from parents donors fans and players, and it was not pretty. If he already knew what to do, he would've done it. He couldn't. Stitt is in something of an impossible position. As I have said, I think he is a "sunk" cost, and I suspect he may realize as much.

It's simply a fact. It ties in with my broader criticisms of how the Athletic Department [doesn't] promote the sports on campus. You'd think football, the biggest, would be a good exemplar given that it actually has been popular with the students in the recent past; a made-for-success model for campus interaction and promotion, and one that the other "lesser" sports might be able to tie their wagons to.

But, unlike Delaney, Stitt just isn't part of it. I don't really care that you think I'm "on Stitt." It's the biggest sport program and, especially given Basketball's budget cut for promotion, the Elephant. I like to see sports "engage" the campus community, in turn because that generates supportive alumni when the kids graduate.

Like Engstrom, it's absurd to say "let go" of a major influence on campus or on sports. It's absurd. I brought it up because 1) it's germane to the presence of varsity sports in the student community and 2) it's true.

You object because you don't like criticism of "Stitt." Like Engstrom, who was a super-nice guy, people legitimately committed to the success of this institution needed to separate petty loyalties from institutional needs. Engstrom stayed far too long -- in large part because of people like you who didn't "want to hear about it."

People like you don't support programs, you help destroy them by inane appeals to loyalty and "shut up" about serious problems. I didn't have to merely predict, to a barrage of hatemail, where I thought football was headed this year. It happened. And you hate that and you hate the fact that someone called it, and it wasn't you. I am sure your good judgment will continue to guide you: don't pay any attention to anyone who actually got it right, with Engstrom or with Stitt or, for that matter, about JJ and that fiasco.

I think Travis is a great coach, but BB is missing something with the students. Stitt doesn't care because he doesn't need it. But it isn't because Bob Stitt lifts a finger. He doesn't "seem interested" and while some players have offered suggestions as to "why," -- and they are interesting reasons -- it doesn't do any good to discuss them on egriz; all it does is inflame the sniffer crowd.

But, if there were a more active campus/student presence, I also think it would have at least a spillover effect for BB. In part because FB got the promotional budget for it, and BB lost half of its budget to the FB budget. So, yes, the "attitude" is part of what is frustrating because of that indirect effect on BB (and the other varsity sports as well). If Stitt's not interested, the concern is that it closes budget doors to on-campus promotional efforts for BB and everyone else.

I have a different perspective than you, or most, egrizzers. And I have specific reasons for those perspectives and it's based on a long experience here. Campus varsity sports can have a synergistic effect on student participation and enthusiasm. Although students are pretty down on FB after this past season, I was also disheartened to see the Kaimin commenting that most students didn't care; they didn't care about the Griz-Cat game. That's part of that campus "social networking" I have referred to. And it also relates to "tipping points" in program development, and the feeling that one is coming for football, represented in some part by student attitudes which are dramatically changing according to the Kaimin.

It's ahead of non-student opinion, and its a better resource than you (generically). I'd like to see BB benefiting from the synergy, but unfortunately and in large part because FB got more of the budget for it this year, FB is also paying no attention to developing student interest. Stitt's just not interested, and the students are beginning to respond to that. So, how to promote BB against that tide and with FB getting the budget support for that kind of development but refusing to do it on campus?

Well, you represent the know-it-alls that predicted a great past FB season: playoffs for sure! If students are beginning to fall away from the varsity sports, but you don't want Stitt even mentioned, aren't you part of the problem here? How does BB, then, "go it alone?"

UM has the makings of a "great" program here for Basketball. I am talking since Heathcote days, including when beating Gonzaga and Adrian Buonchristiani was a special season privilege. And seeing the students as a big part of that isn't just because "it's nice," its because it puts UM a whole level ahead of BSC if the students participate as they used to, and can, and for recruiting as well.

Contrary to the football threads, where lugubrious and ridiculous people are arguing that "success" isn't a recruiting tool, it is the very best recruiting tool, and team success and strong student support are hand-in-hand to the appearance and the achievement of success.

Done well, "Our House" can mean Dahlberg Arena.

I enjoy reading what you have to say, except when you're writing a novel. Need to condense. :)

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