Pflu and UM agree to buy-out terms

[grizdoc]

I have posted before that everyone who assisted, including the media and the missoulian was appreciated.

But that still does not make it ok for the Missoulian to act in any way they please. I am fully within my rights and bounds to criticize the destructive behavior of Gwen Florio and her editorial team pushing the attacks on my University and town.

It would be wrong for me to no stand up to this injustice that the missoulian is perpetrating against our University football program just because they had at one point helped me. People helped my family because we are part of this community. And I am concerned and angry over the Missoulians attacks on UM for the same reason.

I am not hiding behind anonymity like many posters on here who attack me. I do believe what I say, and believe the Missoulian does not care about UM, Missoula, Montana, or even the actual or alleged victims and the accused based on the tabloid quality articles they have printed for the last 6 months.

Nothing sells papers like a fabricated sex scandal does it. Seems to be working for the Missoulian thats why these attacks continue on a daily basis and have been doing so for the last 5 - 6 months.

Stop supporting this continuing attack on UM football. Stop supporting the Missoulian in any way.

Brandon Palmer

Well, we can agree on a couple of things. First, Florio has no business continually printing her drivel and yes the Missoulian has not always been UM friendly.

Yet, there is a larger problem here and that is "our" football team. Since the begining of the Hauck years, our football team have not been the poster boys for good behavior. Quite frankly, there have been too many brushes with the law. Lets be honest here, we all know if you have the resources you can fight and win against the system. So, for those who like to sweep things under the rug as the charges did not stick, there is a problem. I do believe, the accused are innocent until proven guilty. However, back to the sex scandal, where there is smoke there typically is fire. I would argue, had the Penn State scandal not occurred, this might not be as big of story. Right now we have three investigations going on, one which has been going on for five months (NCAA) and the DOE and DOJ. I would recommend everyone hold of judging until the reports are in. Do we need to improve, yes.

Better days are ahead of us. It is time to move on.

[Umista]

Grizdoc, some of us are simple minded Griz fans. I am in that previous gathering, simple. I like to keep things simple and in order.

I have stated for years "if the Griz are dirty I am out" and I stand by my statement. I am a serious giver to the cause. I love the fact we recruit the downtrodden kids from low areas and give them a chance. We take a chance on these kids and sometimes it borders on a "serious chance" but I firmly believe in the USA and giving young adults a way to improve themselves. We have been very lucky during the past number of years and I am proud of what the University has done in this regard for all sports.

I am not talking solely about football. You mentioned smoke and fire. Did you mean subtle manipulation or did you hint at significant wrong doing by football players? Your insincere insinuations that your knowledge and perception of the Griz football program is and has been bad to the bone. Your claim and basis is like "smoke and fire" on automatic pilot.

Yes, these and other young people are less than perfect and are not what we want them to be at all times. We want to feel proud of them. Not just win games but perform and act in dignified Montana dignity with class. Simple. Perhaps I went on a bit long. I agree it is time to move on.

[Growler1]

I have posted before that everyone who assisted, including the media and the missoulian was appreciated.

But that still does not make it ok for the Missoulian to act in any way they please. I am fully within my rights and bounds to criticize the destructive behavior of Gwen Florio and her editorial team pushing the attacks on my University and town.

It would be wrong for me to no stand up to this injustice that the missoulian is perpetrating against our University football program just because they had at one point helped me. People helped my family because we are part of this community. And I am concerned and angry over the Missoulians attacks on UM for the same reason.

I am not hiding behind anonymity like many posters on here who attack me. I do believe what I say, and believe the Missoulian does not care about UM, Missoula, Montana, or even the actual or alleged victims and the accused based on the tabloid quality articles they have printed for the last 6 months.

Nothing sells papers like a fabricated sex scandal does it. Seems to be working for the Missoulian thats why these attacks continue on a daily basis and have been doing so for the last 5 - 6 months.

Stop supporting this continuing attack on UM football. Stop supporting the Missoulian in any way.

Brandon Palmer

Well, we can agree on a couple of things. First, Florio has no business continually printing her drivel and yes the Missoulian has not always been UM friendly.

Yet, there is a larger problem here and that is "our" football team. Since the begining of the Hauck years, our football team have not been the poster boys for good behavior. Quite frankly, there have been too many brushes with the law. Lets be honest here, we all know if you have the resources you can fight and win against the system. So, for those who like to sweep things under the rug as the charges did not stick, there is a problem. I do believe, the accused are innocent until proven guilty. However, back to the sex scandal, where there is smoke there typically is fire. I would argue, had the Penn State scandal not occurred, this might not be as big of story. Right now we have three investigations going on, one which has been going on for five months (NCAA) and the DOE and DOJ. I would recommend everyone hold of judging until the reports are in. Do we need to improve, yes.

Better days are ahead of us. It is time to move on.

Valid post, although the apologists will try to spin this towards their agenda to win at all cost (Umista, are you listening?)

[Umista]

Growler, I am deaf and dumb. No, not dumb and dumber.

Win at any cost, cheat if you must, lying is a plus. Scotch with ice!

[islander]

[argh!]

it will never end...

[Tokyogriz]

Thanks Islander.

Exhibit A shows the cost for Engstroms folly with Pflugrad costing more than just the $44,500 plus his benefits which cost UM $733 (times 9 months) reported in tabloids.

An additional $27,181 payable next january 2013 and unused sick pay of $6,376.

Of course this is all in ADDITION to his regular full time salary of $157,000.

[goatcreekgriz]

Looks like it adds up to what he's entitled to as a state employee through the end of the year. Not quite a million bucks.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

Pflu - $157,000 PLUS health insurance benefits & 44,500 = $201,000 (plus benefits cost)

Oday - $155,281 (Plus Benefits)

Total cost of Royce Engstrom not doing his job and giving yearly reviews in January is $356,781 plus additional benifits costs.

If Royce had simply done his january employee reviews (which is part of his job and he never gave one to oday in 2 years) he could have simply said he wasnt renewing contracts. In the case of Oday at least and saved UM a $157,000 plus benefits and with Pflu we would have saved at least the $44,000.

Now UM will pay double salaries for these positions this year. How many professors would we have paid with this $356,000?

This should come out of Royce Engstroms paycheck. Or an even better solution would be to non-renew his contract effective IMMEDIATELY! (We would have to pay a double salary to him and his replacement but eh thats ok right Roycie?)

Total cost to UM and UM athletics is going to be much larger than this initial pricetag as well. Engstrom needs to be held accountable for this as well.

Contact the Board of Regents to express your anger with Royce and his handling of this. They hold Engstroms contract and have his leash in hand. The BOR are the ones who need to be flooded with calls demanding Engstroms removal.

GFY retard style

[goatcreekgriz]

The timing and terms of the agreement are interesting. If Pflugrad were to take another job without this settlement, then his earnings would mitigate his damages but the agreement does not provide for any credit to UM against the scheduled payouts. Looks like Pflugrad may have a job offer out there, and good for him.

[Tokyogriz]

Looks like it adds up to what he's entitled to as a state employee through the end of the year. Not quite a million bucks.

$235,278 including his benefits.

Not chump change either is it. Add O'Days $155,000 for his full year payment and we are at a $390,278.

Half a million dollars sure would have gone a long ways in any department on campus.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

A half million dollars is chump change...............

[goatcreekgriz]

Well, it's certainly not the seven-figure exposure some crowed about, which was my point. It would be nice for other programs to have more dollars, of course, but an athletic program faced with such high expectations is also exposed to greater risks. Engstrom may or may not survive, but I appreciate his desire for a coaching change under the circumstances. The payout is certainly more than Pat Kennedy's cell phone bills but it's manageable -- and it's part of the cost of doing business. Time to move on.

[garizzalies]

i think its funny that the day we find out UM is paying a good chunk of change to ex-employees, we also learn it's mysterioulsy squeezing about the same amount outta the vets.......and you laughed at my tinfoil hat. Ha. who's doin this right here right now

[goatcreekgriz]

Tuition for Vets is being restored, at least per Missoulian[i].[/i]

[garizzalies]

well then, good thing i was wearing my tin foil hat when you rained on my parade
i'll have to read the paper tomorrow to see now who's gonna get the squeeze.

[Tokyogriz]

Engstroms paycheck should get the squeeze.

[moose/squirrel]

Pflu - $157,000 PLUS health insurance benefits & 44,500 = $201,000 (plus benefits cost)

Oday - $155,281 (Plus Benefits)

Total cost of Royce Engstrom not doing his job and giving yearly reviews in January is $356,781 plus additional benifits costs.

If Royce had simply done his january employee reviews (which is part of his job and he never gave one to oday in 2 years) he could have simply said he wasnt renewing contracts. In the case of Oday at least and saved UM a HUGE chunk of money. With Pflu we would have saved at least the $44,000.

Now UM will pay double salaries for these positions this year. How many professors would we have paid with this $356,000?

This should come out of Royce Engstroms paycheck. Or an even better solution would be to non-renew his contract effective IMMEDIATELY!

Total cost to UM and UM athletics is going to be much larger than this initial pricetag as well. Engstrom needs to be held accountable for this.

Or he could have fired them with cause sent them packing and treated them with no respect and hurt their future careers. AND there is always cause to be found........

Absolute bullshit brochaco...we all realize your agenda here, you've made it clear. If the Royster tried to fire with cause it would cost the school a lot of dollars more than they will be paying. You are not particularly credible here on this issue.

[moose/squirrel]

Pflu - $157,000 PLUS health insurance benefits & 44,500 = $201,000 (plus benefits cost)

Oday - $155,281 (Plus Benefits)

Total cost of Royce Engstrom not doing his job and giving yearly reviews in January is $356,781 plus additional benifits costs.

If Royce had simply done his january employee reviews (which is part of his job and he never gave one to oday in 2 years) he could have simply said he wasnt renewing contracts. In the case of Oday at least and saved UM a HUGE chunk of money. With Pflu we would have saved at least the $44,000.

Now UM will pay double salaries for these positions this year. How many professors would we have paid with this $356,000?

This should come out of Royce Engstroms paycheck. Or an even better solution would be to non-renew his contract effective IMMEDIATELY!

Total cost to UM and UM athletics is going to be much larger than this initial pricetag as well. Engstrom needs to be held accountable for this.

Or he could have fired them with cause sent them packing and treated them with no respect and hurt their future careers. AND there is always cause to be found........

Absolute bullshit brochaco...we all realize your agenda here, you've made it clear. If the Royster tried to fire with cause it would cost the school a lot of dollars more than they will be paying. You are not particularly credible here on this issue.

[GrizLA]

Looks like it adds up to what he's entitled to as a state employee through the end of the year. Not quite a million bucks.

$235,278 including his benefits.

Not chump change either is it. Add O'Days $155,000 for his full year payment and we are at a $390,278.

Half a million dollars sure would have gone a long ways in any department on campus.

Half a million dollars is the real estate commission on a good sale in Bev Hills, Malibu, Encino, Pasadena..trust me, I know...it is peanuts compared to the coaches in the "move up area" of the BCS....think big, kid.

[TxGriz]

-- and it's part of the cost of doing business.

The cost of doing business "retard style".

[doebrmn]

The funny part about all of this is if the Griz had lost two more games this past year and failed to make the playoffs, every poster here would have been calling for Pflu to be let go. Under that scenario the buy-out would have been the same and everyone on here would have been arguing it was money well spent and worth it to get another coach that could win football games. Instead, he was not retained for reasons no on on here knows and yet now it is a complete waste of money that could be used for other expenses.

The sad part is that had Pflu been let go for losing two more football games and it cost the University $220k that really would have been a waste. If he was let go because he was not living up to the standards of a College coach off the field, was not taking the actions necessary to maintain the integrity of the program, and was failing to guide the young men in the program in a manner that will help them become productive citizens, then spending an additional $220k was probably well worth it and may have saved the university considerable money down the road.

[Tokyogriz]

If he was let go because he was not living up to the standards of a College coach off the field, was not taking the actions necessary to maintain the integrity of the program, and was failing to guide the young men in the program in a manner that will help them become productive citizens, then spending an additional $220k was probably well worth it and may have saved the university considerable money down the road.

You have no idea what your talking about on this. Its obvious you do not know Pflugrad and have done zero research on any of your b-s accusation/speculation.

The only actual team issue was a grade issue last fall in my research. The emails show Oday and Pflugrad trying to get these addressed and hopefully most those kids have their act together this spring. We will find out in the fall.

[doebrmn]

Read the whole post before you go running off at the mouth. As stated, I do not know the reasons. My point was IF he was let go for issues off the field those are far more important then what is happening on the field and spending the money was likely a necessary expense. In the future, try to read the post instead of simply jumping on every opportunity to let everyone know you are a big Pflu supporter. We get that, but until (which may never be the case) the facts are know, try to maintain some modicum of objectivity.

[tnt]

The funny part about all of this is if the Griz had lost two more games this past year and failed to make the playoffs, every poster here would have been calling for Pflu to be let go. Under that scenario the buy-out would have been the same and everyone on here would have been arguing it was money well spent and worth it to get another coach that could win football games. Instead, he was not retained for reasons no on on here knows and yet now it is a complete waste of money that could be used for other expenses.

The sad part is that had Pflu been let go for losing two more football games and it cost the University $220k that really would have been a waste. If he was let go because he was not living up to the standards of a College coach off the field, was not taking the actions necessary to maintain the integrity of the program, and was failing to guide the young men in the program in a manner that will help them become productive citizens, then spending an additional $220k was probably well worth it and may have saved the university considerable money down the road.

It was only by the grace of god he didn't lose two (and maybe three) more games. It was rare at best that he ever had two halves put together and even rarer that he looked prepared for the first half. He didn't look a bit better his second season than his first.

All that aside doebrmn make an excellent post, and hits the nail EXACTLY on the head why a change needed made. Its NOT about winning, but all is forgiven if we do. The academic problems would be enough for me absolutely NO excuse to get to the point we were......