UCLA/USC

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kemajic
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info wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:50 pm The Oregon and Washington State Legislatures’ will not allow Oregon State or Washington State to be separated from their respective “big”bros Oregon and Washington.
The $$$$ involved can change that.
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Spanky2
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kemajic wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:10 am
info wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:50 pm The Oregon and Washington State Legislatures’ will not allow Oregon State or Washington State to be separated from their respective “big”bros Oregon and Washington.
The $$$$ involved can change that.
That’s for sure! Money is transforming college athletics at a rapid pace. Soon, after the dust settles, we won’t be able to recognize the new landscape that is being formed by money. Not a good future for small college athletics.
CatGrad-UMGradStu
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Spanky2 wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 7:35 am
kemajic wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:10 am
The $$$$ involved can change that.
That’s for sure! Money is transforming college athletics at a rapid pace. Soon, after the dust settles, we won’t be able to recognize the new landscape that is being formed by money. Not a good future for small college athletics.
FCOA and NIL was just the start for the student-athletes actually generating all this money for those two super conferences.

I've read considerable opinions on the two LA schools move to the BIG10 and one can't help but look at the Ivies who allowed their football programs to suffer as the powers that be felt academics ought to take precedence. Colorado has that reputation now as their administration feels it's fine to have a team but they're not willing to upgrade Folsom Field or pay their coaches--case in point was when the Michigan State coach left before coaching a game. Years ago, Fordham essentially destroyed their athletics and several Jesuit schools shut down athletics.

The prevailing thought seems to be there'll be two super conferences, then the next wannabe level such as the Sun Belt, Big 12, Mountain West, pac whatever, ACC and then the FCS.

Those super conference schools whose administrations turned their athletic departments over to their school's foundations and run them like businesses rather than sit at the mercy of state Regents for the athletic department's funding are reaping the rewards of strong administrations starting with the Oklahoma-Georgia lawsuit against the NCAA in the early 80s.

A lot of good is going to come out of this for college sports fans such as the pitiful officiating the pac, Mountain West and Big Sky is cringe worthy noted for will improve. It has to.

Two super conferences, the next tier of wannabe schools and the FCS. The only question relative the two super conferences: How many schools and divisions will they have? The sky is not falling. Shitty schools with administration and faculty with their inflated sense of self-worth will get slapped back down to earth.

Change is good.
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CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am
Spanky2 wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 7:35 am
That’s for sure! Money is transforming college athletics at a rapid pace. Soon, after the dust settles, we won’t be able to recognize the new landscape that is being formed by money. Not a good future for small college athletics.
FCOA and NIL was just the start for the student-athletes actually generating all this money for those two super conferences.

I've read considerable opinions on the two LA schools move to the BIG10 and one can't help but look at the Ivies who allowed their football programs to suffer as the powers that be felt academics ought to take precedence. Colorado has that reputation now as their administration feels it's fine to have a team but they're not willing to upgrade Folsom Field or pay their coaches--case in point was when the Michigan State coach left before coaching a game. Years ago, Fordham essentially destroyed their athletics and several Jesuit schools shut down athletics.

The prevailing thought seems to be there'll be two super conferences, then the next wannabe level such as the Sun Belt, Big 12, Mountain West, pac whatever, ACC and then the FCS.

Those super conference schools whose administrations turned their athletic departments over to their school's foundations and run them like businesses rather than sit at the mercy of state Regents for the athletic department's funding are reaping the rewards of strong administrations starting with the Oklahoma-Georgia lawsuit against the NCAA in the early 80s.

A lot of good is going to come out of this for college sports fans such as the pitiful officiating the pac, Mountain West and Big Sky is cringe worthy noted for will improve. It has to.

Two super conferences, the next tier of wannabe schools and the FCS. The only question relative the two super conferences: How many schools and divisions will they have? The sky is not falling. Shitty schools with administration and faculty with their inflated sense of self-worth will get slapped back down to earth.

Change is good.
Change is good for the two super conferences as $$$$$$$$ will be their reward as it will be for their athletes. I can’t see where change is going to be good for the ACC nor the left over conferences. Finally, a conference like the Big Sky……no comment.
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Ursa Major
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CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am
Spanky2 wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 7:35 am
That’s for sure! Money is transforming college athletics at a rapid pace. Soon, after the dust settles, we won’t be able to recognize the new landscape that is being formed by money. Not a good future for small college athletics.
FCOA and NIL was just the start for the student-athletes actually generating all this money for those two super conferences.

I've read considerable opinions on the two LA schools move to the BIG10 and one can't help but look at the Ivies who allowed their football programs to suffer as the powers that be felt academics ought to take precedence. Colorado has that reputation now as their administration feels it's fine to have a team but they're not willing to upgrade Folsom Field or pay their coaches--case in point was when the Michigan State coach left before coaching a game. Years ago, Fordham essentially destroyed their athletics and several Jesuit schools shut down athletics.

The prevailing thought seems to be there'll be two super conferences, then the next wannabe level such as the Sun Belt, Big 12, Mountain West, pac whatever, ACC and then the FCS.

Those super conference schools whose administrations turned their athletic departments over to their school's foundations and run them like businesses rather than sit at the mercy of state Regents for the athletic department's funding are reaping the rewards of strong administrations starting with the Oklahoma-Georgia lawsuit against the NCAA in the early 80s.

A lot of good is going to come out of this for college sports fans such as the pitiful officiating the pac, Mountain West and Big Sky is cringe worthy noted for will improve. It has to.

Two super conferences, the next tier of wannabe schools and the FCS. The only question relative the two super conferences: How many schools and divisions will they have? The sky is not falling. Shitty schools with administration and faculty with their inflated sense of self-worth will get slapped back down to earth.

Change is good.
Keep walking, Mack. Go peddle your woke bullshit somewhere else.
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CatGrad-UMGradStu
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Spanky2 wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:55 am
CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am

FCOA and NIL was just the start for the student-athletes actually generating all this money for those two super conferences.

I've read considerable opinions on the two LA schools move to the BIG10 and one can't help but look at the Ivies who allowed their football programs to suffer as the powers that be felt academics ought to take precedence. Colorado has that reputation now as their administration feels it's fine to have a team but they're not willing to upgrade Folsom Field or pay their coaches--case in point was when the Michigan State coach left before coaching a game. Years ago, Fordham essentially destroyed their athletics and several Jesuit schools shut down athletics.

The prevailing thought seems to be there'll be two super conferences, then the next wannabe level such as the Sun Belt, Big 12, Mountain West, pac whatever, ACC and then the FCS.

Those super conference schools whose administrations turned their athletic departments over to their school's foundations and run them like businesses rather than sit at the mercy of state Regents for the athletic department's funding are reaping the rewards of strong administrations starting with the Oklahoma-Georgia lawsuit against the NCAA in the early 80s.

A lot of good is going to come out of this for college sports fans such as the pitiful officiating the pac, Mountain West and Big Sky is cringe worthy noted for will improve. It has to.

Two super conferences, the next tier of wannabe schools and the FCS. The only question relative the two super conferences: How many schools and divisions will they have? The sky is not falling. Shitty schools with administration and faculty with their inflated sense of self-worth will get slapped back down to earth.

Change is good.
Change is good for the two super conferences as $$$$$$$$ will be their reward as it will be for their athletes. I can’t see where change is going to be good for the ACC nor the left over conferences. Finally, a conference like the Big Sky……no comment.
ESPN and Fox are going to need games to fill their schedules. Very little of the country would stay up to watch a pac game in the Pacific Time Zone but they'd watch at least part of a game in the Rocky Mountain Time Zone. The Power 5 has too many schools like Wazzu, Oregon State, Colorado, North Carolina State, Georgia Tech, Kansas, Duke, Vanderbilt that wouldn't be competitive in the MVFC for certain and probably not in the Big Sky even with all the free money they get just being affiliated with schools such as Southern Cal.

As far as basketball being an argument? The older I get, the more I hate that game. I'd rather watch track and field or baseball. Even gymnastics, rowing and crew, or skiing.
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CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am
Spanky2 wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 7:35 am
That’s for sure! Money is transforming college athletics at a rapid pace. Soon, after the dust settles, we won’t be able to recognize the new landscape that is being formed by money. Not a good future for small college athletics.
FCOA and NIL was just the start for the student-athletes actually generating all this money for those two super conferences.

I've read considerable opinions on the two LA schools move to the BIG10 and one can't help but look at the Ivies who allowed their football programs to suffer as the powers that be felt academics ought to take precedence. Colorado has that reputation now as their administration feels it's fine to have a team but they're not willing to upgrade Folsom Field or pay their coaches--case in point was when the Michigan State coach left before coaching a game. Years ago, Fordham essentially destroyed their athletics and several Jesuit schools shut down athletics.

The prevailing thought seems to be there'll be two super conferences, then the next wannabe level such as the Sun Belt, Big 12, Mountain West, pac whatever, ACC and then the FCS.

Those super conference schools whose administrations turned their athletic departments over to their school's foundations and run them like businesses rather than sit at the mercy of state Regents for the athletic department's funding are reaping the rewards of strong administrations starting with the Oklahoma-Georgia lawsuit against the NCAA in the early 80s.

A lot of good is going to come out of this for college sports fans such as the pitiful officiating the pac, Mountain West and Big Sky is cringe worthy noted for will improve. It has to.

Two super conferences, the next tier of wannabe schools and the FCS. The only question relative the two super conferences: How many schools and divisions will they have? The sky is not falling. Shitty schools with administration and faculty with their inflated sense of self-worth will get slapped back down to earth.

Change is good.
They just pumped $156 million into it just a few years ago.

https://www.ralphiereport.com/2015/9/23 ... the-future
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mtgrizrule
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Ursa Major wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:01 am
CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am

FCOA and NIL was just the start for the student-athletes actually generating all this money for those two super conferences.

I've read considerable opinions on the two LA schools move to the BIG10 and one can't help but look at the Ivies who allowed their football programs to suffer as the powers that be felt academics ought to take precedence. Colorado has that reputation now as their administration feels it's fine to have a team but they're not willing to upgrade Folsom Field or pay their coaches--case in point was when the Michigan State coach left before coaching a game. Years ago, Fordham essentially destroyed their athletics and several Jesuit schools shut down athletics.

The prevailing thought seems to be there'll be two super conferences, then the next wannabe level such as the Sun Belt, Big 12, Mountain West, pac whatever, ACC and then the FCS.

Those super conference schools whose administrations turned their athletic departments over to their school's foundations and run them like businesses rather than sit at the mercy of state Regents for the athletic department's funding are reaping the rewards of strong administrations starting with the Oklahoma-Georgia lawsuit against the NCAA in the early 80s.

A lot of good is going to come out of this for college sports fans such as the pitiful officiating the pac, Mountain West and Big Sky is cringe worthy noted for will improve. It has to.

Two super conferences, the next tier of wannabe schools and the FCS. The only question relative the two super conferences: How many schools and divisions will they have? The sky is not falling. Shitty schools with administration and faculty with their inflated sense of self-worth will get slapped back down to earth.

Change is good.
Keep walking, Mack. Go peddle your woke bullshit somewhere else.
Ursa, I'm not trying to be a jerk here, have to ask. Are you thinking, we're better off in the current Big Sky and FCS, than a dramatically realigned Mountain West, with better teams?

Catgrad is right about tv and or streaming options still need filled after the power division gets theirs. I agree with much of what he is saying. Catgrad, what are your conditions to justify a move for UM and MSU?

In my opinion, a realigned 2nd division likely helps many upper FCS and non power FBS schools. Of course, the changes would have to include no less than a true 16 team playoff format, with teams bidding for home games, through the semis or championship.
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CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am
Change is good.
This change will be good for all those power 5 schools, but I don't think it will be nearly as good for FCS and lower echelon FBS athletic departments and programs.
CatGrad-UMGradStu
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Yukon wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:52 am
CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am

FCOA and NIL was just the start for the student-athletes actually generating all this money for those two super conferences.

I've read considerable opinions on the two LA schools move to the BIG10 and one can't help but look at the Ivies who allowed their football programs to suffer as the powers that be felt academics ought to take precedence. Colorado has that reputation now as their administration feels it's fine to have a team but they're not willing to upgrade Folsom Field or pay their coaches--case in point was when the Michigan State coach left before coaching a game. Years ago, Fordham essentially destroyed their athletics and several Jesuit schools shut down athletics.

The prevailing thought seems to be there'll be two super conferences, then the next wannabe level such as the Sun Belt, Big 12, Mountain West, pac whatever, ACC and then the FCS.

Those super conference schools whose administrations turned their athletic departments over to their school's foundations and run them like businesses rather than sit at the mercy of state Regents for the athletic department's funding are reaping the rewards of strong administrations starting with the Oklahoma-Georgia lawsuit against the NCAA in the early 80s.

A lot of good is going to come out of this for college sports fans such as the pitiful officiating the pac, Mountain West and Big Sky is cringe worthy noted for will improve. It has to.

Two super conferences, the next tier of wannabe schools and the FCS. The only question relative the two super conferences: How many schools and divisions will they have? The sky is not falling. Shitty schools with administration and faculty with their inflated sense of self-worth will get slapped back down to earth.

Change is good.
They just pumped $156 million into it just a few years ago.

https://www.ralphiereport.com/2015/9/23 ... the-future
https://www.denverpost.com/2022/07/03/u ... ll-future/
CatGrad-UMGradStu
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CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:33 am
Yukon wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:52 am

They just pumped $156 million into it just a few years ago.

https://www.ralphiereport.com/2015/9/23 ... the-future
https://www.denverpost.com/2022/07/03/u ... ll-future/
In other words, about half of what Tennessee is pumping into theirs, for comparison and one can assume the south can get a hell of a lot more bang for the buck compared to the Denver area.
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Ursa Major
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mtgrizrule wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:57 am
Ursa Major wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:01 am

Keep walking, Mack. Go peddle your woke bullshit somewhere else.
Ursa, I'm not trying to be a jerk here, have to ask. Are you thinking, we're better off in the current Big Sky and FCS, than a dramatically realigned Mountain West, with better teams?

Catgrad is right about tv and or streaming options still need filled after the power division gets theirs. I agree with much of what he is saying. Catgrad, what are your conditions to justify a move for UM and MSU?

In my opinion, a realigned 2nd division likely helps many upper FCS and non power FBS schools. Of course, the changes would have to include no less than a true 16 team playoff format, with teams bidding for home games, through the semis or championship.
Rule, I’m all for moving up. I have been for years.

As far as the Mountain West, I think that it would be peachy to rejoin our regional peer universities. The best possible fit for UM. However, the big question seems to be does the Mountain West share the same level of attraction with UM and Bozeman State as we do to it? Since most conference realignments are predominantly predicated on tv markets and revenue, maybe not.

My overarching concern for moving up, and something we chronically ignore in our voluminous move-up threads, was expressed by Spanky above:
Spanky wrote:
Going to be interesting to see how the administration and the BOR reacts to these changes or if they will do anything.
Montana is traditionally a highly fiscally conservative state. Is there enough political will for the significant costs it would take to bring UM & Bozeman State up to FBS standards (more athletic programs, scholarships and infrastructure) and then allow them to compete financially (program budgets, FCOA, NIL) with conference peers? I have my doubts.

You can write up projected budgets all day long to show earnings from tv contracts rewarded in an FBS conference that would cover the extra costs, but at the end of the day, I think you’ll have many Montanans screaming bloody murder from the sticker shock of those costs.

Excuse me for not embracing the runaway money grab that has gripped the college football landscape. There will be a lot of financial rewards for top tier programs. Unfortunately we’re not one of them.

I hope there are ongoing planning talks with the ADs and BOR looking at these possibilities.
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Ursa Major
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HelenaHandBasket wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 10:51 am
CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 8:21 am
Change is good.
This change will be good for all those power 5 schools, but I don't think it will be nearly as good for FCS and lower echelon FBS athletic departments and programs.
This
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CatGrad-UMGradStu
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CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:41 am
In other words, about half of what Tennessee is pumping into theirs, for comparison and one can assume the south can get a hell of a lot more bang for the buck compared to the Denver area.
https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/J ... ities.aspx
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There are significant resources at the FBS level. And it’s not just football television revenue. A MWC basketball team who advances to the Sweet 16 would earn more than the total annual athletic budgets of most bsc programs. Paying the fixed-cost bills would not be an issue, in my mind.

The large but — and it’s a really big one — is the answer to the questions Ursa raises: specifically what will NIL due to the economics of college athletics long-term, and will the state legislators have the foresight to invest up-front monies necessary for the start up costs, in order to get long-run financial gain from the athletic departments.
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mtgrizrule wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:57 am
Ursa Major wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:01 am

Keep walking, Mack. Go peddle your woke bullshit somewhere else.
Ursa, I'm not trying to be a jerk here, have to ask. Are you thinking, we're better off in the current Big Sky and FCS, than a dramatically realigned Mountain West, with better teams?

Catgrad is right about tv and or streaming options still need filled after the power division gets theirs. I agree with much of what he is saying. Catgrad, what are your conditions to justify a move for UM and MSU?

In my opinion, a realigned 2nd division likely helps many upper FCS and non power FBS schools. Of course, the changes would have to include no less than a true 16 team playoff format, with teams bidding for home games, through the semis or championship.
Mtgrizrule, in answer to your question and being a Native American native Montanan who chooses to live elsewhere, I don't see the state of Montana ever allowing their two flagship universities to become a competitive football program at the next level. I can only imagine the hell that would be raised were the administration in either institution to approach the Board of Regents with a viable plan to move up to the Bowl Championship level.

Hell, there's so much pushback internally to any upgrades the way it is now it's asking some of your left leaning faculty to not indoctrinate our kids with their socialistic bullshit...but I digress...

The only hope for moving up lives and/or plays around Flathead Lake or Big Sky and they don't have a vested interest in either institution, for the most part. Some of those residents, like the governor, could write a check and finance the move up for both schools.

I used to attend Georgia athletic functions with my wife in many locations outside Georgia. Can you imagine what the hell would happen if the coaching staffs of either the Cats or Griz were to go to the Twin Cities, Salt Lake, Denver or Hotlanta for a booster event?
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CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 1:09 pm
mtgrizrule wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:57 am

Ursa, I'm not trying to be a jerk here, have to ask. Are you thinking, we're better off in the current Big Sky and FCS, than a dramatically realigned Mountain West, with better teams?

Catgrad is right about tv and or streaming options still need filled after the power division gets theirs. I agree with much of what he is saying. Catgrad, what are your conditions to justify a move for UM and MSU?

In my opinion, a realigned 2nd division likely helps many upper FCS and non power FBS schools. Of course, the changes would have to include no less than a true 16 team playoff format, with teams bidding for home games, through the semis or championship.
Mtgrizrule, in answer to your question and being a Native American native Montanan who chooses to live elsewhere, I don't see the state of Montana ever allowing their two flagship universities to become a competitive football program at the next level. I can only imagine the hell that would be raised were the administration in either institution to approach the Board of Regents with a viable plan to move up to the Bowl Championship level.

Hell, there's so much pushback internally to any upgrades the way it is now it's asking some of your left leaning faculty to not indoctrinate our kids with their socialistic bullshit...but I digress...

The only hope for moving up lives and/or plays around Flathead Lake or Big Sky and they don't have a vested interest in either institution, for the most part. Some of those residents, like the governor, could write a check and finance the move up for both schools.

I used to attend Georgia athletic functions with my wife in many locations outside Georgia. Can you imagine what the hell would happen if the coaching staffs of either the Cats or Griz were to go to the Twin Cities, Salt Lake, Denver or Hotlanta for a booster event?

You mean besides a large number of alumni and fans showing up and having a great time?
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CatGrad-UMGradStu
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EverettGriz wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:15 pm
CatGrad-UMGradStu wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 1:09 pm

Mtgrizrule, in answer to your question and being a Native American native Montanan who chooses to live elsewhere, I don't see the state of Montana ever allowing their two flagship universities to become a competitive football program at the next level. I can only imagine the hell that would be raised were the administration in either institution to approach the Board of Regents with a viable plan to move up to the Bowl Championship level.

Hell, there's so much pushback internally to any upgrades the way it is now it's asking some of your left leaning faculty to not indoctrinate our kids with their socialistic bullshit...but I digress...

The only hope for moving up lives and/or plays around Flathead Lake or Big Sky and they don't have a vested interest in either institution, for the most part. Some of those residents, like the governor, could write a check and finance the move up for both schools.

I used to attend Georgia athletic functions with my wife in many locations outside Georgia. Can you imagine what the hell would happen if the coaching staffs of either the Cats or Griz were to go to the Twin Cities, Salt Lake, Denver or Hotlanta for a booster event?

You mean besides a large number of alumni and fans showing up and having a great time?
I've yet to hear of either a Cat or Griz function outside of Montana with the Athletic Departments and coaches in attendance. Both schools make their rounds throughout Montana.
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EverettGriz wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:24 pm There are significant resources at the FBS level. And it’s not just football television revenue. A MWC basketball team who advances to the Sweet 16 would earn more than the total annual athletic budgets of most bsc programs. Paying the fixed-cost bills would not be an issue, in my mind.

The large but — and it’s a really big one — is the answer to the questions Ursa raises: specifically what will NIL due to the economics of college athletics long-term, and will the state legislators have the foresight to invest up-front monies necessary for the start up costs, in order to get long-run financial gain from the athletic departments.
EG,

I hope that one or both of the schools are doing some behind the scenes lobbying on these issues in Helena with the BOR. At least to put the idea on the table, gauge the support for such a move and develop some potential contingency plans.

I can foresee a scenario where the hot chick in class says “yes” on going to the school dance with you only to later have to call her back and say “my parents won’t let me go.”

Even a concerned citizens group could do some preliminary advocating for the cause. With the slowdown in the housing market I’m sure Mike and Brint have some free time on their hands. They could load Data Point into a small bowl grab a cold pack at Ole’s and be in Helena in two hours.
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Ursa Major wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:01 pm
EverettGriz wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:24 pm There are significant resources at the FBS level. And it’s not just football television revenue. A MWC basketball team who advances to the Sweet 16 would earn more than the total annual athletic budgets of most bsc programs. Paying the fixed-cost bills would not be an issue, in my mind.

The large but — and it’s a really big one — is the answer to the questions Ursa raises: specifically what will NIL due to the economics of college athletics long-term, and will the state legislators have the foresight to invest up-front monies necessary for the start up costs, in order to get long-run financial gain from the athletic departments.
EG,

I hope that one or both of the schools are doing some behind the scenes lobbying on these issues in Helena with the BOR. At least to put the idea on the table, gauge the support for such a move and develop some potential contingency plans.

I can foresee a scenario where the hot chick in class says “yes” on going to the school dance with you only to later have to call her back and say “my parents won’t let me go.”

Even a concerned citizens group could do some preliminary advocating for the cause. With the slowdown in the housing market I’m sure Mike and Brint have some free time on their hands. They could load Data Point into a small bowl grab a cold pack at Ole’s and be in Helena in two hours.
Brint + Mike + beer+ on the road= DISASTER
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