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From Jud to Travis, Griz fans have had it good

grizzlyjournal

Well-known member
The palpable irony of the facts is clear: Montana’s greatest (statistically speaking) road win over a Power 5 university was its 2002, 70-68 win over the then 19th-ranked Stanford Cardinal. The tiny handful of other historic wins (including Wayne Tinkle’s vs. Oregon in 2009 and vs. UCLA in 2010; Mike Montgomery’s win over Kansas St. in 1978) pale by comparison.

That team’s coach? Pat Kennedy, whose 23-35 (.397) Montana career lasted a mere two seasons. A week earlier, Kennedy’s Griz had given visiting Gonzaga a home-court scare, before losing 75-67. After that game, Kennedy spoke at length about how he planned to turn the Grizzlies into a regional and nationally recognized mid-major power on a level equal to the Zags. Ummm, ok. The more lasting effect: Gonzaga has never played another game in Missoula.

Three years later, then-coach Larry Krystkowiak’s upstart Griz demolished the Cardinal 88-69 in Stanford’s last-ever visit to Missoula. Krysko departed shortly thereafter, making certain to emphasize he was leaving his alma mater because the salaries for him and his coaches were (paraphrase here) grossly insufficient. True. True.

Sadly (I guess… nothing we locals can do about salaries) the Montana Grizzlies and Missoula have been unable to reach the college basketball heights equal to Gonzaga and Spokane, a mere 200 miles west. Nevertheless, Missoula’s fans have fared very well when compared to most very small (and UM is small) schools and environs nationally, with two NCAA appearances by Krysko’s Griz, three (and a CIT home-court appearance) by succeeding coach Wayne Tinkle’s Griz, and two NCAA and an NIT plus a CIT appearance by Travis DeCuire’s Griz teams. Those 11 post-season appearances since 2005 total 3 more than the previous six coaches racked up combined.

In total, however: Very impressive. Missoula and UM fans have had it good.

In truth, the Montana coaches and their records, listed below, except Holst and Kennedy, ALL established roots in Missoula before departing and having pretty illustrious careers as major collegiate coaches. BUT, all of them… every single one of them, had teams suffer “embarrassing” 30-to-47 point losses vs. major collegiate competition. The wins vs Power 5 teams were cool, but few & far between. Nonetheless, overall, thanks to those coaches, the Montana Griz have been very, very good.

I’ve personally watched well over 95% of Montana’s home games since Heathcote’s first season. I know this: there are a lot of universities and their fans around the country who openly envy what Montana’s fans have taken for granted over the last 50-plus seasons.

Let the records below speak the truth. But, a point of emphasis: current Montana Coach, Travis DeCuire’s record has placed him as an EQUAL, in EVERY category. He belongs (by all standards and all categories) in the illustrious Montana Coaching Tree. His three Big Sky championships ties Wayne Tinkle atop the list. No one’s going to hear criticism of coach DeCuire and his staff from me.

MONTANA GRIZZLIES – POST-SEASON APPEARANCES
Jud Heathcote 1971-76 (5 seasons): 80-23 – .597
Big Sky Championships: ONE
Post-Season record: 1-2: 1975 – Beat Utah St 69-63; lost to UCLA 67-64; lost to UNLV 75-67).
[b]Jim Brandenburg 1976-78 (2 seasons): 26-29 (variable, due to forfeits)[/b]
Big Sky Championships: ONE 1978 (Griz lost tourney title game 62-55 OT vs Weber State in Missoula)
Post-Season record: Zero.
Mike Montgomery 1978-86 (8 seasons): 155-76 – .669
Big Sky Championships: ZERO
Post-Season record: 0-2 Two NIT invites: 1985—Lost to UCLA, 78-47; 1986--Lost to TCU, 76-69 in Missoula.
Stew Morrill 1986-91 (5 seasons): 98-51 – .652
Big Sky Championships: ONE
Post-Season record: 0-1. 1991--Lost 99-65 to UNLV.
Blaine Taylor 1991-98 (7 seasons): 141-66 .680
Big Sky Championships: TWO (1992 in Missoula, 1997 in Flagstaff)
Post-Season record: 0-3. 1992—Lost 78-68 to Florida State; Lost 90-60 to UTEP in NIT; 1997—Lost 92-54 to Kentucky.
Don Holst 1988-2002 (4 seasons): 57-56 .504
Big Sky Championships: ONE
Post-Season record: 0-1. 2001—Lost 81-62 to Oregon.
Pat Kennedy 2002-04 (2 seasons): 23-35 .397
Big Sky Championships: ZERO
Post-Season appearances/record: Zero.
Larry Krystkowiak 2004-06 (2 seasons): 42-20 .677
Big Sky Championships: TWO
Post-Season record: 1-2. 2005—Lost 88-77 to Washington; 2006—Beat Nevada 87-79, Lost 69-56 to Boston College.
Wayne Tinkle 2006-2014 (8 seasons): 158-91 .635
Big Sky Championships: THREE
Post-Season record: 0-4 2010—Lost 62-57 to New Mexico; 2011—Lost 87-76 to Duquesne in CBI tourney in Missoula; 2012—Lost 73-49 to Wisconsin; 2014—Lost 81-34 to Syracuse.
Travis DeCuire 2014-Current (8th season) 145-87 .628
Big Sky Championships: THREE.
Post-Season record: 0-4. 2015—Lost 81-64 to Texas A&M in NIT; 2016—Lost 79-75 to Nevada in NIT; 2018—Lost 61-47 to Michigan; 2019—Lost 74-55 to Michigan.
 
GrizLA said:
I thought it was Texas A&M, not Texas that UM lost to....

It was Texas A & M and was played in 2015, not 2013.

Also, Montana Lost to Weber State in 1978, not 1977 in the Big Sky Conference championship game in Missoula. I remember that season because was the year I watched Montana beat Weber State in Ogden. Michael Ray Richardson hit a half court shot to end the first half and freshman Rod Brandon made 2 clutch freethrows to win it.
 
Another great write up Journal. You should copy and paste it in the “Dear Travis” thread. I started watching Griz hoops in the early Monte years. It’s nice to hear from those with the “long game” perspective.
 
Excellent job. A little perspective is always needed in our freak out overreaction world we live in.
 
Yo, journal. Great post. As always. Your are the true historian of Montana basketball!

I too share the "by and large and in general" magnificence of the Grizzly basketball program ever since the Heathcote era. Many memorable moments and I have seen my share over the years though mostly in California, not Missoula. A few highlights:
--Michael Ray single-handedly destroying the Pacific Tigers in Stockton, the while the Pacific coach stood gesticulating and pleading with his players, "Please stop that guy!" They could not.
--Several games at Stanford, including a win when one of our guards, David Bell, got super hot; another, though not a win, when we had a young center, Andrew Strait, that they could not stop; and a third just before the pandemic when we were down only two at half before hitting one of those ice-cold stretches and losing big.
--Two NCAA appearances at San Jose, the first when we could have taken down a heavily-favored New Mexico team had it not been for a late-game blunder by a young Will Cherry, but the other the horrific beat-down by Syracuse;
--The best game I ever saw the Griz play against UCLA at Pauley, where I shared seats with my Tarheel buddy as Montana led by twenty in the second half and cruised to a decisive win against the Bruins behind Cherry, Qvale, Selvig and company.
--A recent game against USC, where I was able to wrangle courtside seats for me and my same Tarheel buddy to watch the Griz behind Ahmaad Rorie battle the Trojans in an even-steven game, in which we outscored them from the field but lost at the free throw line under the banner of "getting homered."
--Several more less notable games at San Jose (under DeCuire where we stunk it up), Pacific (where I saw Brian Qvale as a freshman and could tell he had a big future), St. Mary's, Pepperdine, Northridge, Ogden Sacramento, Portland, I've-been-everywhere with this team.
So I fully share your passion both for this team and the historical excellence of our program.

Please note: The basis for my post was not to get rid of DeCuire. I admire him as a man, and respect what he's done for this program. I was trying to be constructive, to amplify on something Mike Montgomery said, not me: "I could not diagram the Montana offense." Or: "Montana is getting hammered down-low."

And as much as I respect the history of our program, my motto is "Carpe Diem." If I see a weakness in today's team, I am going to call it out, as Montgomery did.

DeCuire's best years here have been his first five. But if you go back and look at the guts of those teams, you will find this: They depended on two quality big men, Breunig and Krslovic, neither of whom DeCuire recruited, and two exceptionally athletic and talented guards that he did, Michael Oguine and our only four-star player ever to my knowledge, Ahmaad Rorie. It is my premise that talent of that level can hide coaching and recruiting weaknesses.

I hope I'm wrong on both counts. I hope DeCuire is the offensive genius that he showed as the all-time assists leader at Montana. I hope Bannan develops into an outstanding big man, and that John Solomon and Rhett Reynolds turn out to be quality big men a la the long line of quality big men at Montana.

But none of that was on display against Oregon--as Mike Montgomery pointed out several times, on both topics--and I only amplified in my post.
 
citay said:
Yo, journal. Great post. As always. Your are the true historian of Montana basketball!

I too share the "by and large and in general" magnificence of the Grizzly basketball program ever since the Heathcote era. Many memorable moments and I have seen my share over the years though mostly in California, not Missoula. A few highlights:
--Michael Ray single-handedly destroying the Pacific Tigers in Stockton, the while the Pacific coach stood gesticulating and pleading with his players, "Please stop that guy!" They could not.
--Several games at Stanford, including a win when one of our guards, David Bell, got super hot; another, though not a win, when we had a young center, Andrew Strait, that they could not stop; and a third just before the pandemic when we were down only two at half before hitting one of those ice-cold stretches and losing big.
--Two NCAA appearances at San Jose, the first when we could have taken down a heavily-favored New Mexico team had it not been for a late-game blunder by a young Will Cherry, but the other the horrific beat-down by Syracuse;
--The best game I ever saw the Griz play against UCLA at Pauley, where I shared seats with my Tarheel buddy as Montana led by twenty in the second half and cruised to a decisive win against the Bruins behind Cherry, Qvale, Selvig and company.
--A recent game against USC, where I was able to wrangle courtside seats for me and my same Tarheel buddy to watch the Griz behind Ahmaad Rorie battle the Trojans in an even-steven game, in which we outscored them from the field but lost at the free throw line under the banner of "getting homered."
--Several more less notable games at San Jose (under DeCuire where we stunk it up), Pacific (where I saw Brian Qvale as a freshman and could tell he had a big future), St. Mary's, Pepperdine, Northridge, Ogden Sacramento, Portland, I've-been-everywhere with this team.
So I fully share your passion both for this team and the historical excellence of our program.

Please note: The basis for my post was not to get rid of DeCuire. I admire him as a man, and respect what he's done for this program. I was trying to be constructive, to amplify on something Mike Montgomery said, not me: "I could not diagram the Montana offense." Or: "Montana is getting hammered down-low."

And as much as I respect the history of our program, my motto is "Carpe Diem." If I see a weakness in today's team, I am going to call it out, as Montgomery did.

DeCuire's best years here have been his first five. But if you go back and look at the guts of those teams, you will find this: They depended on two quality big men, Breunig and Krslovic, neither of whom DeCuire recruited, and two exceptionally athletic and talented guards that he did, Michael Oguine and our only four-star player ever to my knowledge, Ahmaad Rorie. It is my premise that talent of that level can hide coaching and recruiting weaknesses.

I hope I'm wrong on both counts. I hope DeCuire is the offensive genius that he showed as the all-time assists leader at Montana. I hope Bannan develops into an outstanding big man, and that John Solomon and Rhett Reynolds turn out to be quality big men a la the long line of quality big men at Montana.

But none of that was on display against Oregon--as Mike Montgomery pointed out several times, on both topics--and I only amplified in my post.

citay: I am a firm believer in honorable dialogue/discourse, whether engaged over a cup of coffee or via a forum. In that light, I've always respected, though not always agreed with, your stated viewpoints. I did not take offense at your post, and I did not write mine to diss or slam your posts. The majority of those who currently post at the eGriz basketball form are similarly dedicated to respectful discourse as well.

The focus & timing of my post is so timed... probably due to my career as a sportswriter (Missoulian and as a freelancer). To wit: I long have developed a wariness of "bandwagons." Case in point: a group of "honorable alum," who in 2008 -- after the 07-08 Griz posted a 14-16 season record -- campaigned for a coaching change (glad that didn't happen! :lol: ). The worst-case scenario, however, was what happened in 2002 to Don Holst two weeks after his Griz won the Big Sky Conf. title in Bozeman, where probably Montana's greatest-ever win over the Bobcats in Bozeman came via a thunderous last-second put-back dunk. In truth, it's MY belief that Kennedy's early-season success the next fall came from the returners of that very team, minus Holst, of course. To this day, many folks accept the mistaken pretzel logic that Holst was a coach that needed to be replaced by Kennedy (This is for example only: It's now water under the proverbial bridge. I do NOT want to debate this further, because I have high personal regard for Mr. Holst.).

However, I am willing to further debate how some coaches develop their teams game-by-game throughout a season, aware that early games need to be used to develop a team... to get that team gradually to a point where they're in "peak" form, ready to vie for a conference title. As a result, Montana's loss to Oregon may well be a game we can "look back on," later this season as a reference point of sorts. Wayne Tinkle's 2011-12 and 2012-13 teams were rare exceptions of teams that dominated the Big Sky from game one (despite a tough Weber State team). But some incredible Montana teams peaked very late in the season (4 examples: Blaine Taylor's 1996-97 Griz, Holst's 2002-02 Griz, and Larry Krystkowiak's very good 2004-05 and 2005-06 teams that won both titles on the regular season champ & host team's court: Ogden and Flagstaff). As such: I'm willing to place my bets on this 2021-22 Montana Griz team.
 
citay said:
....
--Two NCAA appearances at San Jose, the first when we could have taken down a heavily-favored New Mexico team had it not been for a late-game blunder by a young Will Cherry, but the other the horrific beat-down by Syracuse;....
I'd argue that had our best scorer from that team (Anthony Johnson) not went through an arctic cold stretch (probably due to his vision, which as we found out years later was....subpar to say the least), the Griz would have won easily. If I remember correctly, he didn't make a shot until around 3 or 4 minutes left in the game.
 
MissoulaMarinerFan said:
citay said:
....
--Two NCAA appearances at San Jose, the first when we could have taken down a heavily-favored New Mexico team had it not been for a late-game blunder by a young Will Cherry, but the other the horrific beat-down by Syracuse;....
I'd argue that had our best scorer from that team (Anthony Johnson) not went through an arctic cold stretch (probably due to his vision, which as we found out years later was....subpar to say the least), the Griz would have won easily. If I remember correctly, he didn't make a shot until around 3 or 4 minutes left in the game.

Good point. I'd forgotten about that aspect of the game. I do remember vividly how good Qvale was. They could not stop him in the low post.
 
citay said:
MissoulaMarinerFan said:
I'd argue that had our best scorer from that team (Anthony Johnson) not went through an arctic cold stretch (probably due to his vision, which as we found out years later was....subpar to say the least), the Griz would have won easily. If I remember correctly, he didn't make a shot until around 3 or 4 minutes left in the game.

Good point. I'd forgotten about that aspect of the game. I do remember vividly how good Qvale was. They could not stop him in the low post.

Yeah. That was most gut-wrenching about the game. Griz were playing with pretty much one hand behind their back the whole game. Another "what if?????".
 
... Which brings up the age-old challenge for modern coaches: "Where/how does a good team establish its game over the first 10 minutes? In the paint? or "On the perimeter?"
Well, whatever route you first employ, statistics show:
1. In order to establish your interior game, then your paint players need to convert approximately 47-to-51% of their shots to force the opponent to adjust. Or...
2. If you decide to establish your perimeter game, then your long-range snipers need to convert approximately 36-to-42% of your shots to stretch the opponents' defensive clamp on the key.
----- In Montana's win over Southern Miss, perimeter players converted 35.71% of their shots in the first half and 50% in the second half. That success opened up the interior, where Montana made 22 points within a very tight arc under the basket.
----- In Montana's loss to Oregon, after converting its first two treys for a 6-0 lead, it proceeded to shoot 5-18 (27.8%) on many open looks from the perimeter. Overall the Griz took 46 field goal attempts (the Ducks took 47 shots) and converted at the rate of 26.1%. Some may argue that Oregon defenders altered Montana's shots in the paint. Perhaps. But I saw a bewildering bushel-full of open misses, and I can't really explain why. Jud Heathcote often repeated a humorous variation of this sentence: "We call an open layup a 90% shot. We hope."
The blunt statistical standard for most D1 wins is this: Your team must make a minimum of 46% of your total field goals to have a decent chance of winning, and must convert between 36% to 42% from beyond the arc to make your opponent's D respect your outside game.
 
citay said:
Yo, journal. Great post. As always. Your are the true historian of Montana basketball!

I too share the "by and large and in general" magnificence of the Grizzly basketball program ever since the Heathcote era. Many memorable moments and I have seen my share over the years though mostly in California, not Missoula. A few highlights:
--Michael Ray single-handedly destroying the Pacific Tigers in Stockton, the while the Pacific coach stood gesticulating and pleading with his players, "Please stop that guy!" They could not.
--Several games at Stanford, including a win when one of our guards, David Bell, got super hot; another, though not a win, when we had a young center, Andrew Strait, that they could not stop; and a third just before the pandemic when we were down only two at half before hitting one of those ice-cold stretches and losing big.
--Two NCAA appearances at San Jose, the first when we could have taken down a heavily-favored New Mexico team had it not been for a late-game blunder by a young Will Cherry, but the other the horrific beat-down by Syracuse;
--The best game I ever saw the Griz play against UCLA at Pauley, where I shared seats with my Tarheel buddy as Montana led by twenty in the second half and cruised to a decisive win against the Bruins behind Cherry, Qvale, Selvig and company.
--A recent game against USC, where I was able to wrangle courtside seats for me and my same Tarheel buddy to watch the Griz behind Ahmaad Rorie battle the Trojans in an even-steven game, in which we outscored them from the field but lost at the free throw line under the banner of "getting homered."
--Several more less notable games at San Jose (under DeCuire where we stunk it up), Pacific (where I saw Brian Qvale as a freshman and could tell he had a big future), St. Mary's, Pepperdine, Northridge, Ogden Sacramento, Portland, I've-been-everywhere with this team.
So I fully share your passion both for this team and the historical excellence of our program.

Please note: The basis for my post was not to get rid of DeCuire. I admire him as a man, and respect what he's done for this program. I was trying to be constructive, to amplify on something Mike Montgomery said, not me: "I could not diagram the Montana offense." Or: "Montana is getting hammered down-low."

And as much as I respect the history of our program, my motto is "Carpe Diem." If I see a weakness in today's team, I am going to call it out, as Montgomery did.

DeCuire's best years here have been his first five. But if you go back and look at the guts of those teams, you will find this: They depended on two quality big men, Breunig and Krslovic, neither of whom DeCuire recruited, and two exceptionally athletic and talented guards that he did, Michael Oguine and our only four-star player ever to my knowledge, Ahmaad Rorie. It is my premise that talent of that level can hide coaching and recruiting weaknesses.

I hope I'm wrong on both counts. I hope DeCuire is the offensive genius that he showed as the all-time assists leader at Montana. I hope Bannan develops into an outstanding big man, and that John Solomon and Rhett Reynolds turn out to be quality big men a la the long line of quality big men at Montana.

But none of that was on display against Oregon--as Mike Montgomery pointed out several times, on both topics--and I only amplified in my post.

Will never forget Andrew Straight schooling Frazekus (sp) from Nevada in another NCAA Tourney win under Larry!
 
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