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article for greenie, if he'll read it

argh!

Well-known member
DONOR
hey greenie, the link is to an scmp article by a 'distinguished' ucla business professor that i was hoping you would read. the reason is, other then when it comes to whatever we disagree on, you read critically and analyze information well, and i am wondering what you think of the article. i have my own views, but i won't put them here yet, in order to not accidentally influence you, not that i could. thanks, and no worries if you skip it, i know it is way off the topic of egriz.

https://www.scmp.com/comment/opinion/article/3174655/chinese-ambassadors-us-television-interview-chance-reflect-how-deal
 
I opened the link but couldn't get to the whole article. Have to figure out how to deal with the paywall. I am influenced by everything you say, on China and otherwise, as I am with many other posters and people. No one on the board knows more about China than you do. I have been to Hong Kong 5 times, and Beijing once. I know 3 times about China now, after reading your posts and articles in the past several years. That's why I like the discussion. I learn a lot. I like getting challenged. I like learning about posters, as I think a lot can be learned about them from what they say. To me, that is interesting. Then, with some, I like the throw their BS back at them.
 
mthoopsfan said:
I opened the link but couldn't get to the whole article. Have to figure out how to deal with the paywall. I am influenced by everything you say, on China and otherwise, as I am with many other posters and people. No one on the board knows more about China than you do. I have been to Hong Kong 5 times, and Beijing once. I know 3 times about China now, after reading your posts and articles in the past several years. That's why I like the discussion. I learn a lot. I like getting challenged. I like learning about posters, as I think a lot can be learned about them from what they say. To me, that is interesting. Then, with some, I like the throw their BS back at them.

here is the article (below). I won't comment on the contents before you read it, but I did look this guy up, and found he's written multiple articles for ccp state propaganda, i.e. china daily, the global times. he's a ucla professor, and for the life of me, i don't know why we are paying someone a salary who writes multiple articles like that. also, after a brief email exchange with him... i'm less impressed with his intellectual rigor.

the first line is the title. thanks!


Chinese ambassador’s US TV interview a chance to reflect on how to deal with interrupters
The Face the Nation programme during which host Margaret Brennan repeatedly interrupted Chinese ambassador Qin Gang sparked debate and highlighted cultural differences
To survive and succeed in the West, Asians must be aware of the value systems there and adopt smart strategies in the face of chronic interruptions

“What should I do to make him stop interrupting me?” This question was in my head when a senior professor interrupted me several times during my job interview at UCLA in 1985 as a graduate student. This professor claimed my research work had already been done by him 10 years earlier, and he kept badgering me when I tried to explain why this was not the case. Since then, I have gradually learned how to respond to interruptions.
I recalled that job interview experience when Qin Gang, China’s ambassador to the United States, was asked to clarify Beijing’s position on the Russian invasion of Ukraine on CBS’s Face the Nation programme on March 20. During the nine-minute interview, host Margaret Brennan interrupted Qin more than 20 times.
Was Brennan rude to Qin? Was her interviewing style racially or politically motivated? During my discussions with my friends in Hong Kong, mainland China and the United States, two different perspectives emerged.

Many Hongkongers told me they were often interrupted by their Western colleagues at work. From the perspective of Hongkongers and mainland Chinese, our Chinese values teach us to respect seniors and officials.
Therefore, Chinese viewers might naturally find Brennan rude. Indeed, some Chinese social media users complained that the American host was disrespectful at best and hostile towards China at worst.
However, most Americans and Westerners in general believe in treating everyone the same regardless of their status. Therefore, it is no surprise that most of my American friends did not think Brennan was rude.
Are Americans rude? According to a 2010 Pew Research survey, the global perception of Americans was divided. More than 50 per cent of respondents from Turkey, Indonesia, Jordan and Canada viewed Americans as rude, but less than 30 per cent of respondents from Poland, Germany, the Netherlands and India shared that opinion.
Brennan often interrupts her guests on her show when their comments are not in line with the views of the American majority. This is a smart move because popularity rating is a key measure of television shows. Brennan’s interruptions can be construed by viewers as her being on their side.
Butting in: what gender, nationality, power have to do with it


Putting the perceived rudeness and the political narrative aside, did Brennan treat Qin differently because he is Chinese? I’m not sure, but I know that women and Asians are often interrupted in meetings in the US.
Speaking up is a power trip, and interrupting someone can be seen as a way to stand out. In an individualistic society such as the US, non-assertiveness can be perceived as being meek and reticence associated with being secretive.

In Asian societies, most people try to fit in to gain mutual support and ensure harmony. Parents, teachers and bosses prefer obedience to defiance. Reticence and non-assertiveness become social norms in collective societies.
Given these cultural differences, how should Asians behave in the US without violating their Asian values? How should Chinese employees cope with their Western colleagues at work in Hong Kong or mainland China? I would like to make four suggestions.
First, scan the interruptions and classify them into two types. For collaborative interruptions that express agreement, acknowledge them quickly and continue your thought. For intrusive interruptions that attempt to change the subject, continue to express your thoughts. If you stop, the interrupter could take over and hijack the conversation, derailing your original plan.

Interruptions and insults dominate first Trump-Biden US presidential debate
Second, hold your ground. If the interrupter continues to speak over you, then pause and ask politely: “Would you please be so kind as to let me finish my thought?” Most savvy interrupters will stop to avoid appearing rude.
Third, take it offline. In some cases, the interrupter will not stop. Then you can ask politely: “Can we discuss this after our meeting in private? I would be happy to learn about your views.” This is a polite way that allows the interrupters to save face.
Fourth, prepare to quit. When all else fails, you need to prepare to quit, not surrender. You can ask firmly: “Would you like me to stop so that you can speak the entire time? Or would you like me to continue?”
In Qin’s case, I wondered if Brennan would have stopped interrupting him had he walked off the stage. Walking off makes both parties look bad, but it would have made Brennan look worse for appearing to provoke Qin.
I used this tactic as my last resort during my job interview at UCLA in 1985, and it worked. The interrupter stopped badgering me and I was allowed to finish my job presentation. Later, I was told that UCLA offered me the job partly because of the way I handled the unpleasant interrupter.
To survive and succeed in the US, Asians need to be aware of the American value system and those of other Western societies. Knowledge is power, so fight rudeness with smarts.


Christopher S. Tang is a university distinguished professor and Edward W. Carter chair in business administration at the UCLA Anderson School of Management
CONVERSATIONS (46)
 
argh! said:
mthoopsfan said:
I opened the link but couldn't get to the whole article. Have to figure out how to deal with the paywall. I am influenced by everything you say, on China and otherwise, as I am with many other posters and people. No one on the board knows more about China than you do. I have been to Hong Kong 5 times, and Beijing once. I know 3 times about China now, after reading your posts and articles in the past several years. That's why I like the discussion. I learn a lot. I like getting challenged. I like learning about posters, as I think a lot can be learned about them from what they say. To me, that is interesting. Then, with some, I like the throw their BS back at them.

here is the article (below). I won't comment on the contents before you read it, but I did look this guy up, and found he's written multiple articles for ccp state propaganda, i.e. china daily, the global times. he's a ucla professor, and for the life of me, i don't know why we are paying someone a salary who writes multiple articles like that. also, after a brief email exchange with him... i'm less impressed with his intellectual rigor.

the first line is the title. thanks!


Chinese ambassador’s US TV interview a chance to reflect on how to deal with interrupters
The Face the Nation programme during which host Margaret Brennan repeatedly interrupted Chinese ambassador Qin Gang sparked debate and highlighted cultural differences
To survive and succeed in the West, Asians must be aware of the value systems there and adopt smart strategies in the face of chronic interruptions [I don't like interruptions and never have. I have learned to be more aggressive, if I have to. If people interrupt too much, I disengage.]

“What should I do to make him stop interrupting me?” This question was in my head when a senior professor interrupted me several times during my job interview at UCLA in 1985 as a graduate student. This professor claimed my research work had already been done by him 10 years earlier, and he kept badgering me when I tried to explain why this was not the case. Since then, I have gradually learned how to respond to interruptions. [I have never had an interview-type interruption situation, where you need to avoid irking the person on the other side.]
I recalled that job interview experience when Qin Gang, China’s ambassador to the United States, was asked to clarify Beijing’s position on the Russian invasion of Ukraine on CBS’s Face the Nation programme on March 20. During the nine-minute interview, host Margaret Brennan interrupted Qin more than 20 times. [I don't like new interrupters either, but I can understand how they need to move the conversation along. 20 times is way too many times.]
Was Brennan rude to Qin? [Yes.] Was her interviewing style racially or politically motivated? [Don't know. If she is a big interrupter in interviews, maybe not.] During my discussions with my friends in Hong Kong, mainland China and the United States, two different perspectives emerged.

Many Hongkongers told me they were often interrupted by their Western colleagues at work. From the perspective of Hongkongers and mainland Chinese, our Chinese values teach us to respect seniors and officials. [I come more from the respect side. Some
Asians may come across as quite passive (and polite), and I suppose that could encourage some people to interrupt more.]
Therefore, Chinese viewers might naturally find Brennan rude. Indeed, some Chinese social media users complained that the American host was disrespectful at best and hostile towards China at worst. [I can understand this view.]
However, most Americans and Westerners in general believe in treating everyone the same regardless of their status. Therefore, it is no surprise that most of my American friends did not think Brennan was rude.
Are Americans rude? According to a 2010 Pew Research survey, the global perception of Americans was divided. More than 50 per cent of respondents from Turkey, Indonesia, Jordan and Canada viewed Americans as rude, but less than 30 per cent of respondents from Poland, Germany, the Netherlands and India shared that opinion. [I think a good chunk of Americans are rude. Not all. Not even close to half.]
Brennan often interrupts her guests on her show when their comments are not in line with the views of the American majority. This is a smart move because popularity rating is a key measure of television shows. Brennan’s interruptions can be construed by viewers as her being on their side.
Butting in: what gender, nationality, power have to do with it [Culture has a lot to do with it, as does how one was raised (i.e. polite in conversation, or not).]


Putting the perceived rudeness and the political narrative aside, did Brennan treat Qin differently because he is Chinese? I’m not sure, but I know that women and Asians are often interrupted in meetings in the US. [Me too, but I assume the observation is correct. I have read about women being interrupted more, but I have not observed that, or recognized that.]
Speaking up is a power trip, and interrupting someone can be seen as a way to stand out. In an individualistic society such as the US, non-assertiveness can be perceived as being meek and reticence associated with being secretive. [Only partially accurate.]

In Asian societies, most people try to fit in to gain mutual support and ensure harmony. Parents, teachers and bosses prefer obedience to defiance. Reticence and non-assertiveness become social norms in collective societies.
Given these cultural differences, how should Asians behave in the US without violating their Asian values? How should Chinese employees cope with their Western colleagues at work in Hong Kong or mainland China? I would like to make four suggestions.
First, scan the interruptions and classify them into two types. For collaborative interruptions that express agreement, acknowledge them quickly and continue your thought. For intrusive interruptions that attempt to change the subject, continue to express your thoughts. If you stop, the interrupter could take over and hijack the conversation, derailing your original plan.

Interruptions and insults dominate first Trump-Biden US presidential debate
Second, hold your ground. If the interrupter continues to speak over you, then pause and ask politely: “Would you please be so kind as to let me finish my thought?” Most savvy interrupters will stop to avoid appearing rude.
Third, take it offline. In some cases, the interrupter will not stop. Then you can ask politely: “Can we discuss this after our meeting in private? I would be happy to learn about your views.” This is a polite way that allows the interrupters to save face.
Fourth, prepare to quit. When all else fails, you need to prepare to quit, not surrender. You can ask firmly: “Would you like me to stop so that you can speak the entire time? Or would you like me to continue?”
In Qin’s case, I wondered if Brennan would have stopped interrupting him had he walked off the stage. Walking off makes both parties look bad, but it would have made Brennan look worse for appearing to provoke Qin. [I'd be more likely to punch him, not slap, than walk off. Ha. I somewhat agree with the first 3 suggestions. I don't know what's inside Asians, in this regard or otherwise, so am not sure what they should do.]
I used this tactic as my last resort during my job interview at UCLA in 1985, and it worked. The interrupter stopped badgering me and I was allowed to finish my job presentation. Later, I was told that UCLA offered me the job partly because of the way I handled the unpleasant interrupter.
To survive and succeed in the US, Asians need to be aware of the American value system and those of other Western societies. Knowledge is power, so fight rudeness with smarts. [I somewhat agree.]


Christopher S. Tang is a university distinguished professor and Edward W. Carter chair in business administration at the UCLA Anderson School of Management
CONVERSATIONS (46)

See my responses in the article, in brackets. I rarely interrupt, but probably did it more as time has time has gone on. I grew up very shy. I could respond, but rarely spoke up. In college, I was the kid who was involved in most conversations, by standing there, listening carefully, smiling, but remaining silent. Late in college and in law school, and in my early years on Wall St., I became much less shy (like not shy in many situations, but still shy in some). That remains today. I had to get psyched up to make a phone call when I started practicing. It was like I was preparing to give a speech. We didn't have a phone on the ranch until I was about done with law school. Just rarely used a phone growing up. My college roommate for 3 years, tells my kids that he didn't hear me say more than 2 words at a time until I was a junior. My roommate was Joel Hyatt. Google his wiki.

I will come back to see what you have to say.
 
interesting comments, thanks. correct me if i'm wrong, but you have spent time in china both on business and as a tourist/participant in social events, but you haven't lived there, and don't speak the language. since i have, i think that makes a big difference in our interpretation of this article. here's my take, feel free to point out flaws in logic or just plain disagree:

there are two main thrusts of this article. one is how to deal with interrupters. in that sense, i more or less agree with the guy, it is just common sense. i didn't see the interview the guy talks about, but he does say that the interviewer has a history of interrupting. i think that at the level of ambassador, the interviewee should have been prepared for this, given that he willfully accepted the interview, and presumably would have done some homework on the interviewer before going on national t.v. in his official position. people who interrupt all the time are annoying, and get in the way of making points. if he wanted to make his ccp-vetted points in america, he probably could have chosen a different interviewer or venue.

it is the second thrust of this article that bothers me - the author's 'other' thesis, it seems to me, is that asians are quiet, reserved and "smart", whereas americans are rude interrupters. note that the author didn't make any distinction between 'asians' and 'asian-americans' in the article, so i have no idea where that group might lie on his scale of interrupting. anyway, back to my main point, which is that i think the guy is being intellectually lazy, at best, and racist, at worst, by placing "asians" in one category (polite, non-interrupting), and 'americans' in another (impolite interrupters). this is total b.s., in my view. yes, there are americans, of all races, who interrupt a lot. but there are those who politely listen, and don't interrupt at all. the same can be said for asians. in life and in business, i have met plenty of asians who were rude and interrupted me all the time, both in asia and in the u.s.. people are people, i have a doctor friend in china who i met when i needed some medication. the way people treated her was terrible. i could go on and on about all the rude, interrupting chinese who i've encountered in life (mostly men). i could go on and on about all the rude americans i've encountered in life (mostly men, but quite a few women, too). i asked many asians i know, including some fairly high up in global companies, about this guy's premise, and none agreed with it. indeed, their conclusion was the opposite, albeit they were talking about chinese (mostly men), in china, doing business. so, long story short, i thought this article was racist. maybe you don't agree, but i don't think race or country of origin dictate whether a person will be an 'interrupter' or not. in science, if you don't get interrupted with questions, it is often a bad sign, because it generally means nobody is interested in what you have to say. some people, usually men, get carried away with a certain point or points, and interrupt incessantly. in my experience, some of the worst are asians, from asia. others are white guys, from america or canada or europe. i don't think ethnicity has much to do with it in 2022.

lastly, and most importantly (to me), is that the author, a distinguished professor, is publishing in an international newspaper, drawing ethnicity-based conclusions, with no data to back up what he says. like you and me, he's relying on his analysis anecdotal incidents to draw a conclusion. he never states this, though. he's using the credibility of his position to pass off his speculation about ethnicity-related behavior as fact. i find that disingenuous, and kind of pathetic. he could have left race out of it, and given advice on how to interact with interrupters, without that angle, but in my view, he's pandering to his audience, which based on the comments include a large number of 'little pinks', or ccp-indoctrinated ethnonationalists (read the comments section).

if you manage to read this whole diatribe, let me know what you think. if you want to discuss china more, the news coming out of shanghai is pretty ugly. it all gets censored very quickly, but not quickly enough for some to take screen shots, etc... i could post some articles, etc, if you want. the bottom line is that xi's third term is now in question, as the shanghai faction gains strength because of the awful mess xi's created with 'zero covid', er, 'dynamic zero covid', er, 'social zero covid', or whatever the name has changed to today. thanks again. oh, like you, i was a quiet kid, fairly quiet as a teen, and in college. i had little self confidence. it was much later in life that i developed it. i wasn't athletic at all, and still am not, although i look work out a lot and look like i'm in good shape. it is all for show...
 
mthoopsfan said:
I opened the link but couldn't get to the whole article. Have to figure out how to deal with the paywall. I am influenced by everything you say, on China and otherwise, as I am with many other posters and people. No one on the board knows more about China than you do. I have been to Hong Kong 5 times, and Beijing once. I know 3 times about China now, after reading your posts and articles in the past several years. That's why I like the discussion. I learn a lot. I like getting challenged. I like learning about posters, as I think a lot can be learned about them from what they say. To me, that is interesting. Then, with some, I like the throw their BS back at them.

addendum to my above comments following yours. in my exchange with the author, he stated, with an exclamation point, that the "comments section agrees with me!". the comments section of the scmp is bombarded by ethnonationalists, who blame america for pretty much everything, and praise the ccp every chance they get. many are probably part of the wumao's, aka the 50 cent army who get paid to post pro-ccp comments in order to try to influence opinions. anyway, since you are coming up against a paywall (i'm not, go figure), here are some of the comment (below). i'll post some of those he had to be referring to, given the time frame when i asked the author about the article. later comments expressed a view closer to mine.:

Amenadiel S.
Beautifully summed up "To survive and succeed in the US, Asians need to be aware of the American value system and those of other Western societies. Knowledge is power, so fight rudeness with smarts." These "gwei-los" always think they have some form or superior complex. Raxism is rather rampant, as they always wear an eyeglass with colored lens – unfortunate.

David
@Amenadiel S. It is forbidden in the USA for a Chinese diplomat to tell the truth. Free speech in America is dead. Only hate speech is promoted these days.

Red Panda :.
Lack of social grace, politeness, manners, family education and refinement are one of the reasons why US companies have problems getting started in China. The same thing happened in the 80s when US businessmen went to Japan and lost deals merely because one of them tapped a Japanese CEO on the back or started talking loudly at a dinner meeting before the boss addressed everyone. Obviously - back then as now - they blamed the others of 'unfair' trade practices. Very condescending is what it is as well. There are techniques to make the host look bad; Chinese diplomats should study those tactics.
4d ago • Edited

David P.
Brennan would never treat an American politician to the same rude behavior. Racism is state sponsored in the USA. How dare an Chinese diplomat be allowed to speak the truth
 
argh! said:
interesting comments, thanks. correct me if i'm wrong, but you have spent time in china both on business and as a tourist/participant in social events, but you haven't lived there, and don't speak the language. since i have, i think that makes a big difference in our interpretation of this article. here's my take, feel free to point out flaws in logic or just plain disagree:

there are two main thrusts of this article. one is how to deal with interrupters. in that sense, i more or less agree with the guy, it is just common sense. i didn't see the interview the guy talks about, but he does say that the interviewer has a history of interrupting. i think that at the level of ambassador, the interviewee should have been prepared for this, given that he willfully accepted the interview, and presumably would have done some homework on the interviewer before going on national t.v. in his official position. people who interrupt all the time are annoying, and get in the way of making points. if he wanted to make his ccp-vetted points in america, he probably could have chosen a different interviewer or venue.

it is the second thrust of this article that bothers me - the author's 'other' thesis, it seems to me, is that asians are quiet, reserved and "smart", whereas americans are rude interrupters. note that the author didn't make any distinction between 'asians' and 'asian-americans' in the article, so i have no idea where that group might lie on his scale of interrupting. anyway, back to my main point, which is that i think the guy is being intellectually lazy, at best, and racist, at worst, by placing "asians" in one category (polite, non-interrupting), and 'americans' in another (impolite interrupters). this is total b.s., in my view. yes, there are americans, of all races, who interrupt a lot. but there are those who politely listen, and don't interrupt at all. the same can be said for asians. in life and in business, i have met plenty of asians who were rude and interrupted me all the time, both in asia and in the u.s.. people are people, i have a doctor friend in china who i met when i needed some medication. the way people treated her was terrible. i could go on and on about all the rude, interrupting chinese who i've encountered in life (mostly men). i could go on and on about all the rude americans i've encountered in life (mostly men, but quite a few women, too). i asked many asians i know, including some fairly high up in global companies, about this guy's premise, and none agreed with it. indeed, their conclusion was the opposite, albeit they were talking about chinese (mostly men), in china, doing business. so, long story short, i thought this article was racist. maybe you don't agree, but i don't think race or country of origin dictate whether a person will be an 'interrupter' or not. in science, if you don't get interrupted with questions, it is often a bad sign, because it generally means nobody is interested in what you have to say. some people, usually men, get carried away with a certain point or points, and interrupt incessantly. in my experience, some of the worst are asians, from asia. others are white guys, from america or canada or europe. i don't think ethnicity has much to do with it in 2022.

lastly, and most importantly (to me), is that the author, a distinguished professor, is publishing in an international newspaper, drawing ethnicity-based conclusions, with no data to back up what he says. like you and me, he's relying on his analysis anecdotal incidents to draw a conclusion. he never states this, though. he's using the credibility of his position to pass off his speculation about ethnicity-related behavior as fact. i find that disingenuous, and kind of pathetic. he could have left race out of it, and given advice on how to interact with interrupters, without that angle, but in my view, he's pandering to his audience, which based on the comments include a large number of 'little pinks', or ccp-indoctrinated ethnonationalists (read the comments section).

if you manage to read this whole diatribe, let me know what you think. if you want to discuss china more, the news coming out of shanghai is pretty ugly. it all gets censored very quickly, but not quickly enough for some to take screen shots, etc... i could post some articles, etc, if you want. the bottom line is that xi's third term is now in question, as the shanghai faction gains strength because of the awful mess xi's created with 'zero covid', er, 'dynamic zero covid', er, 'social zero covid', or whatever the name has changed to today. thanks again. oh, like you, i was a quiet kid, fairly quiet as a teen, and in college. i had little self confidence. it was much later in life that i developed it. i wasn't athletic at all, and still am not, although i look work out a lot and look like i'm in good shape. it is all for show...

You are way ahead of me on this subject and know way more about Asians. I didn't see anything you said that I disagreed with or looked wrong or odd. Like I said, you're an expert compared to me.

I have been following Shanghai covid, and now Beijing, but not read anything other than US publication articles. Saw that different views from China are quickly withdrawn or stamped out. Would love to see more stuff. Thx.
 
argh! said:
mthoopsfan said:
I opened the link but couldn't get to the whole article. Have to figure out how to deal with the paywall. I am influenced by everything you say, on China and otherwise, as I am with many other posters and people. No one on the board knows more about China than you do. I have been to Hong Kong 5 times, and Beijing once. I know 3 times about China now, after reading your posts and articles in the past several years. That's why I like the discussion. I learn a lot. I like getting challenged. I like learning about posters, as I think a lot can be learned about them from what they say. To me, that is interesting. Then, with some, I like the throw their BS back at them.

addendum to my above comments following yours. in my exchange with the author, he stated, with an exclamation point, that the "comments section agrees with me!". the comments section of the scmp is bombarded by ethnonationalists, who blame america for pretty much everything, and praise the ccp every chance they get. many are probably part of the wumao's, aka the 50 cent army who get paid to post pro-ccp comments in order to try to influence opinions. anyway, since you are coming up against a paywall (i'm not, go figure), here are some of the comment (below). i'll post some of those he had to be referring to, given the time frame when i asked the author about the article. later comments expressed a view closer to mine.:

Amenadiel S.
Beautifully summed up "To survive and succeed in the US, Asians need to be aware of the American value system and those of other Western societies. Knowledge is power, so fight rudeness with smarts." These "gwei-los" always think they have some form or superior complex. Raxism is rather rampant, as they always wear an eyeglass with colored lens – unfortunate.

David
@Amenadiel S. It is forbidden in the USA for a Chinese diplomat to tell the truth. Free speech in America is dead. Only hate speech is promoted these days.

Red Panda :.
Lack of social grace, politeness, manners, family education and refinement are one of the reasons why US companies have problems getting started in China. The same thing happened in the 80s when US businessmen went to Japan and lost deals merely because one of them tapped a Japanese CEO on the back or started talking loudly at a dinner meeting before the boss addressed everyone. Obviously - back then as now - they blamed the others of 'unfair' trade practices. Very condescending is what it is as well. There are techniques to make the host look bad; Chinese diplomats should study those tactics.
4d ago • Edited

David P.
Brennan would never treat an American politician to the same rude behavior. Racism is state sponsored in the USA. How dare an Chinese diplomat be allowed to speak the truth

Those comments all look stupid, out to lunch, or like bots, to me.
 
mthoopsfan said:
Those comments all look stupid, out to lunch, or like bots, to me.

yes, these are an example of what usually fills the comments section of the scmp. the other views expressed are usually opposite, and also over-the-top. anyway, thanks for looking at that, i wanted to know if i was over-reacting, and figured if i was, 'greenie' would be happy to say it. oh, i'm no expert on asians, there are way too many different cultures there, from japanese to chinese to vietnamese, etc... i do know you can't lump them all into one category, like that ucla professor did.

as for china, here's a video (below) that has been trying to make the rounds on chinese social media, but keeps getting censored. it is called 'april in shanghai', and follows the timeline of mid-march until now. it is translated to english. basically, shanghai people are locked in, and largely on their own. there is another video out there showing all the now-censored weibo posts of people in shanghai committing suicide out of lock-up related desperation. i won't link it. i will, however, link a song by a malaysian rapper who goes by namewee, that got him and the female singing with him erased from the chinese internet and banned from the country. it is translated to english and malay. he is basically trolling the 'little pinks', or young ultra-ethnonationalists. pretty much every line has a double meaning, mocking xi jinping's crazy claims, like that he carried 100kg of wheat ten miles up a steep, unpaved mountain road, balanced on a pole and without changing shoulders. mao level stuff. some taiwanese weight lifters tried to recreate the claim, and couldn't make a quarter kilometer. you will get some of the references, though. and, to conclude, the ccp has drummed up major support for russia, and the things being said, and not censored, on chinese internet are pretty horrible. the ccp wants this internally, but don't want the rest of the world to know it is going on, as internationally they are saying something quite different. the great translation movement covers a lot of that, on twitter.

april in Shanghai video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pzwkFCAv44

little pink song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Rp7UPbhErE
 
this is a surprisingly fair and comprehensive article about the great translation movement, posted by nbcnews, of all sources: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/great-translation-movement-china-russia-ukraine-rcna25693
 
When I went on my first trip to Asia, to the Philippines and Hong Kong, I commented, jokingly, to me wife: "Man, there are a lot of Asians around here."
 
make of this video what you will (below). It is a bunch of videos coming out of locked-down shanghai, via vpn and other back-channel means. they've been locked down for a month, as in jail-like locked down. some very popular guy who happens to be in shanghai just got erased from their intranet for posting "they aren't testing for covid, they are testing for submissiveness". it is hard to say which ones are genuine, and if any are not. i've seen all kinds of seemingly authentic videos like these...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opvjfsRNtA8
 
I listened to and watched the first 8 minutes. Truly amazing. I will finish later. I loved the 95 year old granny. This is the best, and easiest to understand, video that I've seen on this subject. I wonder what my old law firm's China-based lawyers are experiencing. Thx.
 
mthoopsfan said:
I listened to and watched the first 8 minutes. Truly amazing. I will finish later. I loved the 95 year old granny. This is the best, and easiest to understand, video that I've seen on this subject. I wonder what my old law firm's China-based lawyers are experiencing. Thx.

you will probably be interested in the reported number of deaths in comparison to the number of reported cases. it is very, very low, to the point that many different diseases have much higher rates, as do some various types of accidents.

anyway, as it is now, i think shanghai is still mostly locked down. hopefully it is opening up quickly, though, for the sake of the people living there. I guess there are about 180 million total in lockdown in china right now. beijing seems teetering on the edge, and some small parts are locked down, but who knows. seems like politics are involved in what is going on, but that is a long story, and mostly a guessing game.
 
here's new video by the same group, this time on beijing. getting out is probably something your former colleagues would like to do, but they'll probably get locked in. oh, and i noticed they use some slang in this video, with someone calling the general populous 'leeks'. they actually mean chives, but it always gets translated as 'leeks'. anyway, when "leeks" are cut at the base, they grow back. younger chinese started to call themselves that, to represent that every time they grow to become profitable, the government or business world chops them back down, reaps the wealth, leaving them to have to grow again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipoqKAim8_o
 
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