GRIZ game

[LittleBear]

Always interesting watching the Griz play teams from the SEC (Miss State, Georgia, Texas A&M). The difference of brute strength, size, and athleticism is so apparent. One thing we saw tonight that our other SEC opponents lacked was shooting...despite being without Rocket Watts.

One obvious that stood out was the inability to execute offensively. Our offense is so ball screen heavy, and Mississippi St had the bigs to aggressively hedge and disrupt our ball handlers. We were unable to gain any type of advantage, and once the ball handler picked up his dribble, we essentially passed the ball out and went into dribble drive...not good when you are incapable of beating MSU defenders off the dribble. With a team that athletic, it would have been nice to see a little more consistent offense, with more off-ball movement/action. Teams like MSU that are so athletic...its swimming upstream trying to attack them off the dribble. You beat them by off-ball screens, constant movement. Test their help side IQ and discipline. We did that on one possession where Whitney came off a down screen and got to the paint, resulting in a Bannan made 3.

In all, I don't think we'll play many teams that are capable of keeping us out of the paint so efficiently...but without a go-to scorer or savvy 1v1 creator I think there will be lulls where we struggle to score. On top of that our ball handlers outside of Parker aren't great at passing out of the ball screens, so a lot of times we are just picking up our dribble to pass out and reset.

 

[GrizBall]

Blakney should have never came, Carter and Vazquez need to transfer out instead of wasting their time playing for coaches that just have them standing around while the others get triple screens to throw up a bad shot. DeCuire clearly wants to recreate Oguine and Rory but the two guys who's nuts their on look horrible. Josh Bannan looks horrible and other than Martin that starting unit looks trash. I wish I had no reason to watch this but knowing a few kids on the team I have no choice but to suffer thru this. This is utterly pathetic and Coaches need to go, I would never allow one of kids to go to a program like that and I feel for the ones that did.

Troll score = D-. Not far enough over the top. You must be an acolyte of Pickle, author of the best selling tome "Trolling for Dummies".

While I do feel the OP was over top. The points I think he/she is trying to make are legit. It appears Travis favors certain players.

I believe if you look at positions 1-5, there is very little differentiation between the starters and those coming off the bench. This game was essentially over 10 minutes into the game. After that playing time should have been evenly distributed between the 10. Everyone in the top 10 rotation should have played roughly 20 minutes. This way you keep everyone engaged and it is still early in the season. Look at the individual stats and explain why such a minute differential was warranted. If you have ever managed a team in business or athletics you understand the importance of this.

What is the point of Bannan and Whitney playing 28 minutes and Martin playing 26 In this game? While DCH and Vasquez play 16 and Parker plays 11?

Would love to hear a rational explanation.

 

[GrizBall]

https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/gogriz.com/documents/2021/11/13/02_Mississippi_State_box_score_11_13_21.pdf

+\- tells the story.

 

[LittleBear]

Troll score = D-. Not far enough over the top. You must be an acolyte of Pickle, author of the best selling tome "Trolling for Dummies".

While I do feel the OP was over top. The points I think he/she is trying to make are legit. It appears Travis favors certain players.

I believe if you look at positions 1-5, there is very little differentiation between the starters and those coming off the bench. This game was essentially over 10 minutes into the game. After that playing time should have been evenly distributed between the 10. Everyone in the top 10 rotation should have played roughly 20 minutes. This way you keep everyone engaged and it is still early in the season. Look at the individual stats and explain why such a minute differential was warranted. If you have ever managed a team in business or athletics you understand the importance of this.

What is the point of Bannan and Whitney playing 28 minutes and Martin playing 26 In this game? While DCH and Vasquez play 16 and Parker plays 11?

Would love to hear a rational explanation.

You think Travis would rather play favorites instead of winning…or greater production? Day to day practice production might play a factor in minutes. It’s hard for me to believe that college coaches…whose ability to put food on the table for their families are predicated on favorites lol

 

[GrizBall]

While I do feel the OP was over top. The points I think he/she is trying to make are legit. It appears Travis favors certain players.

I believe if you look at positions 1-5, there is very little differentiation between the starters and those coming off the bench. This game was essentially over 10 minutes into the game. After that playing time should have been evenly distributed between the 10. Everyone in the top 10 rotation should have played roughly 20 minutes. This way you keep everyone engaged and it is still early in the season. Look at the individual stats and explain why such a minute differential was warranted. If you have ever managed a team in business or athletics you understand the importance of this.

What is the point of Bannan and Whitney playing 28 minutes and Martin playing 26 In this game? While DCH and Vasquez play 16 and Parker plays 11?

Would love to hear a rational explanation.

You think Travis would rather play favorites instead of winning…or greater production? Day to day practice production might play a factor in minutes. It’s hard for me to believe that college coaches…whose ability to put food on the table for their families are predicated on favorites lol

First, being down 40 points at halftime (Sarcasm) thinking you are coaching to win the game is utter non-sense.

Maybe he believes they can’t challenge this year and are playing for the next 2-3 years. Maybe he is concerned if he doesn’t cater to certain players they will be in the transfer portal next year hurting the future. Maybe he is personally vested in certain players. Maybe it is important to favor players from certain schools, areas, AAU Programs, basketball trainers in order to stay in their good graces for future recruits.

So to answer to your question is yes I do there are other dynamics at play. And in all honesty, I would probably do some many of the same things, but don’t think for a moment that in many programs winning the current game or winning a championship that season is the top priority.

Again, my original question was look at the minutes and statistics tonight and give me a logistical reason for the playing time based on the tonight’s production.

 

[citygriz]

Anderson, Owens and Bannon combined did not score a single point in the paint. The lack of a post game—the biggest recruiting deficiency throughout the DeCuire era.

 

[GrizBall]

Anderson, Owens and Bannon combined did not score a single point in the paint. The lack of a post game—the biggest recruiting deficiency throughout the DeCuire era.

Out of all people I thought you would be happy. 31/55 FGA were 3s. They shot more 3s than 2s .

 

[GrizLA]

This game against a better SEC team was never going to be a good match up for the Griz. UM simply does not have the talent base to reach out and grab the quality and size with any consistentency but they can compete on their own level and the next game against North Dakota should tell us more of what to expect from this year's Griz.
North Dakota was handled easily by UW Milwaukee and the problems they have are similar to those of UM. Should be a good game.

 

[fanofzoo]

Anderson, Owens and Bannon combined did not score a single point in the paint. The lack of a post game—the biggest recruiting deficiency throughout the DeCuire era.

Looking at the stats give me Blankey, Vasquez and Martin with..............as guards.

I keep asking myself, is a beat down a teaching tool ? Maybe if the stars aligned just right and we kept it within 20 a good moment but to schedule a game where you are going to get slapped around.
Is it worth it ?

Offensively is this 20/21 or 21/22, missed a year staying home in the shop.

 

[citygriz]

Anderson, Owens and Bannon combined did not score a single point in the paint. The lack of a post game—the biggest recruiting deficiency throughout the DeCuire era.

Out of all people I thought you would be happy. 31/55 FGA were 3s. They shot more 3s than 2s .

Yes, that’s encouraging. But ya gotta have SOME post presence. The inside-out game opens up the three ball.
NO points in the paint? Tell that to Steph Curry.

 

[Mousegriz]

Anderson, Owens and Bannon combined did not score a single point in the paint. The lack of a post game—the biggest recruiting deficiency throughout the DeCuire era.

Blakney seemed invisible to Whitney and Beasley. Several first half pick and rolls or flashes to basket open......no passes. Then Anderson is fed several times.....can't catch it cleanly....can't make a layup....tries to dunk from 4 feet and comes up short!! Give Blakney some decent PT and the ball a few times.

 

[CleanHOUSE]

Anderson, Owens and Bannon combined did not score a single point in the paint. The lack of a post game—the biggest recruiting deficiency throughout the DeCuire era.

Looking at the stats give me Blankey, Vasquez and Martin with..............as guards.

I keep asking myself, is a beat down a teaching tool ? Maybe if the stars aligned just right and we kept it within 20 a good moment but to schedule a game where you are going to get slapped around.
Is it worth it ?

Offensively is this 20/21 or 21/22, missed a year staying home in the shop.

I don't think this is supposed to be a beat down, its should not be like Bama vs Idaho State or something. I think probably 8 other big sky teams would have put up a more competitive score line than that Griz because they can SHOOT. I expect Griz to be top 3 team in BSC this year, but if we played against an EMPTY FLOOR (not allowed layups) we would shoot 35% and score 61pts. Against BSC our slashing offense and fundamentally sound consistent D will work as intended, but against stronger faster teams that can shoot we simple have no chance, while a team like Portland State or something who can throw up some points would have put on a better showing for BSC last night even though we will probably beat them when we play them. It's just a bit sad because the whole point is to get to the Big Dance but our formula basically produces this kind of result when we have to be a serious underdog...just no chance unless the other team completely shits the bed the whole game like Washington did last year

 

[fanofzoo]

Out of all people I thought you would be happy. 31/55 FGA were 3s. They shot more 3s than 2s .

Yes, that’s encouraging. But ya gotta have SOME post presence. The inside-out game opens up the three ball.
NO points in the paint? Tell that to Steph Curry.

Well said. I think there is a big difference in how you take the 3, down in the clock desperate or set up early before D is totally set.
example whats his name steph.....

 

[GrizSteve]

Looking at the stats give me Blankey, Vasquez and Martin with..............as guards.

I keep asking myself, is a beat down a teaching tool ? Maybe if the stars aligned just right and we kept it within 20 a good moment but to schedule a game where you are going to get slapped around.
Is it worth it ?

Offensively is this 20/21 or 21/22, missed a year staying home in the shop.

I don't think this is supposed to be a beat down, its should not be like Bama vs Idaho State or something. I think probably 8 other big sky teams would have put up a more competitive score line than that Griz because they can SHOOT. I expect Griz to be top 3 team in BSC this year, but if we played against an EMPTY FLOOR (not allowed layups) we would shoot 35% and score 61pts. Against BSC our slashing offense and fundamentally sound consistent D will work as intended, but against stronger faster teams that can shoot we simple have no chance, while a team like Portland State or something who can throw up some points would have put on a better showing for BSC last night even though we will probably beat them when we play them. It's just a bit sad because the whole point is to get to the Big Dance but our formula basically produces this kind of result when we have to be a serious underdog...just no chance unless the other team completely shits the bed the whole game like Washington did last year

This is it! The perfect summary of last years team. Hopefully this can change, but the first 2 games are exactly this and we have basically the same team as last year.

 

[Grizbeer]

Could be an interesting year for Travis with all the things going on in Seattle. I don’t see Hopkins coming back next year at UW, and SU already fired their coach. If UM handles the big sky and makes a noise in the tournament - not winning a game but putting a scare in a 1-3 seed maybe a candidate at UW. If the Griz end up so so and lose in the BSC championship game probably a shoe in for SU.

 

[GrizBall]

Could be an interesting year for Travis with all the things going on in Seattle. I don’t see Hopkins coming back next year at UW, and SU already fired their coach. If UM handles the big sky and makes a noise in the tournament - not winning a game but putting a scare in a 1-3 seed maybe a candidate at UW. If the Griz end up so so and lose in the BSC championship game probably a shoe in for SU.

Also, I don’t know the specifics of Mark Fox’s contract at Cal, but they have been a dumpster fire for a few years now. The only reason Fox could stick around is if the buy-out is too high. Athletics there are not a high priority.

On the other hand, counting the last two seasons + last night, the Griz are 27-26 against D-1 teams (which doesn’t count a loss against Montana Tech).

The Griz are 11-17 in their last 28 D-1 games.

He 100% takes the UW and Cal jobs if offered. Seattle is a backwards move (conference and support) although even with the city’s non- P5 talent and bounce backs you can win big there if the school is open to relaxing some academic requirements. It’s basically his hometown so I assume he would still be interested.

 

[LittleBear]

You think Travis would rather play favorites instead of winning…or greater production? Day to day practice production might play a factor in minutes. It’s hard for me to believe that college coaches…whose ability to put food on the table for their families are predicated on favorites lol

First, being down 40 points at halftime (Sarcasm) thinking you are coaching to win the game is utter non-sense.

Maybe he believes they can’t challenge this year and are playing for the next 2-3 years. Maybe he is concerned if he doesn’t cater to certain players they will be in the transfer portal next year hurting the future. Maybe he is personally vested in certain players. Maybe it is important to favor players from certain schools, areas, AAU Programs, basketball trainers in order to stay in their good graces for future recruits.

So to answer to your question is yes I do there are other dynamics at play. And in all honesty, I would probably do some many of the same things, but don’t think for a moment that in many programs winning the current game or winning a championship that season is the top priority.

Again, my original question was look at the minutes and statistics tonight and give me a logistical reason for the playing time based on the tonight’s production.

lol facts...nobody is arguing Trav was coaching to win the game in the 2nd half. Walkons got in the game.

I absolutely agree that there are extenuating circumstances that factor into playing time. However, favoritism (in my opinion) is low on the totem pole. Looking at the box score I agree that based off production Josh and DJ should have played more. Josh played 16 minutes, for what he did on the court he should have played more. Josh has been playing exclusively the shooting guard position since last year. Whitney and Cam P run the 1. So acknowledging that, we look at who could potentially have taken his minutes...which is obviously Robby, someone who has been highly touted and has been anticipated as a player who is going to take a huge leap from freshman to sophomore year. He played 19 minutes...So then you've got Lonnell, who did not play great either, but is a legit wing who can guard multiple positions, and has a bit more versatility.

Then we have DJ, who was the surprise of the night for me. DJ has been hurt for much of preseason. Didn't play in the maroon-silver but played well against Dickenson. But so did Bannan. 4 days ago everyone is saying Bannan is the go-to guy this season. Bannan played 28 minutes, going 2-8 from the field...which isn't good. But Kyle also played 16 minutes, going 0-6, with zero assists, rebounds, or steals.

Whatever way you chop it up I think its lazy to assume that TD is showing favorites in game one, when all they really had to go off of was practice, 2 non-D1 opponents, and Wazzau. The year is so young, I think its normal to play the lineup as he did, especially because this group is so unproven. If you talk to 10 different ppl I think you will get 6 different answers on who the best player on the team is going to be this year. That being said, if DJ and Josh haven't earned more minutes against North Dakota with their performances, I will be right there with you in questioning substitution patterns.

 

[Mousegriz]

This looks like a 15 seed against a 2 seed.

Our kids look intimidated around the basket. Seem reluctant to take it the hole.

But Mississippi State is a very good team. One of the best we'll see all year.

The Griz looked like a 15 seed? I must have been watching a different game.