Weekly Position Discussion, week 8 - Tight End

[Rjones61]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

 

[marceagfan5]

The griz will need to use a lot of double TE just for pass blocking. Your offense is going to be 2 yards and a cloud of dust. Ellis Henderson should just transfer again.

Wonderful assumptions there. However there's one thing every Scott Gragg-coached O-line has been excellent at, pass protection.

Sacks allowed:

2010: 5th best
2011: Best in the conference
2012: 3rd best
2013: 3rd best

And in 2012 and 2013 the teams ahead of the UM were spread-option teams, Cal Poly and Portland State (both years) where the opportunity to even attempt a sack on a QB was pretty darn rare.

Your claim that he'll need a ton of protection in passing is wrong. First of all he's a great scrambler, one of the three best in the conference right there with Vernon Adams and Garret Saffron. Secondly his running backs, especially Canada and Nguyen are great at picking up blitzes. Finally JJ has the ability that I haven't even seen in Adams or Saffron to find an open target in the face of heavy pressure. Going back and reviewing a lot of his games last year and in 2011 he was deadly efficient in the face of heavy pressure.

Pass protection isn't my concern as much as run blocking is.

Nowhere in my post did I mention sacks. You think the only way a QB gets roughed up or injured is from a sack. The reason he had low sack numbers is because he is mobile. Doesn't mean he wasn't getting knocked on his arse continually.

Quarterbacks who have to throw under consistent heavy pressure are more susceptible to injury.

I am not criticizing JJ. Like I said, he is tough and is a good quarterback. I bet pass protection is his concern since he is the one that takes the punishment. Not middle-aged fatties in old gas guzzling MOPARs who never played the game (AzGrizFan).

Yo, Vernon Adams is the biggest chicken shit pu**y QB in the entire nation. If he has low sack numbers it is only because he is scared of his own shadow. Cannot wait to watch him drop down to the ground like the little bitch he is every time a defender comes within a couple yds from him come Sept.

Guess that bodes well for our first two games at least...

 

[CDAGRIZ]

So, who wants to guess what AG1's Google search terms were for that pic?

 

[AZGrizFan]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

I think we win, and I don't think it'll be as close as last year.

 

[Rjones61]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

I think we win, and I don't think it'll be as close as last year.

Aren't you guys like 12-2 against Cal Poly? So that's a pretty fair guess :lol:

 

[BWahlberg]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

Tough matchup, big time. And it's in CPSLO. Poly returns a lot of guys that got injured through the season. If they stay healthy they could be a real tough team. I think I posted in another thread but I don't think they play EWU this year and I could see the possibility of both EWU and CPSLO going undefeated in conference. Poly's conference road schedule is pretty weak, if I recall correctly.

 

[SaskGriz]

Does Cal Poly still have that little QB? That guy gave us fits last year, I thought we had him dead to rights for about 7 sacks but he was a waterbug back there. I seem to remember he was a transfer/drop down from BYU or something like that.

 

[Rjones61]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

Tough matchup, big time. And it's in CPSLO. Poly returns a lot of guys that got injured through the season. If they stay healthy they could be a real tough team. I think I posted in another thread but I don't think they play EWU this year and I could see the possibility of both EWU and CPSLO going undefeated in conference. Poly's conference road schedule is pretty weak, if I recall correctly.

Thanks for responding. I keep expecting Cal Poly to have their break out season, but it just keeps not happening. I was shocked that they did so poorly last season. I didn't know they had the injury bug. Based on your position discussions, it seems as if they are the worst match up for you guys, just based on their style of play.

 

[BWahlberg]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

Tough matchup, big time. And it's in CPSLO. Poly returns a lot of guys that got injured through the season. If they stay healthy they could be a real tough team. I think I posted in another thread but I don't think they play EWU this year and I could see the possibility of both EWU and CPSLO going undefeated in conference. Poly's conference road schedule is pretty weak, if I recall correctly.

Thanks for responding. I keep expecting Cal Poly to have their break out season, but it just keeps not happening. I was shocked that they did so poorly last season. I didn't know they had the injury bug. Based on your position discussions, it seems as if they are the worst match up for you guys, just based on their style of play.

In-conference, yeah maybe. Assuming NDSU has re-loaded on offense and will smash the ball they'll probably be our toughest/worst matchup, IMO.

 

[BWahlberg]

Does Cal Poly still have that little QB? That guy gave us fits last year, I thought we had him dead to rights for about 7 sacks but he was a waterbug back there. I seem to remember he was a transfer/drop down from BYU or something like that.

He was actually the 3rd string QB due to all the injuries they had he wound up either starting or coming in halfway through in the game we played last year.

 

[grizcountry420]

Good stuff Wahlberg..

 

[EverettGriz]

Great point on Saylor being a potentially huge weapon in the red zone. He'll be a tough match up for most safeties.

 

[PlayerRep]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

The UM linebackers are 230/235, 220, 220 and 215 in the top 4. The next two are 235 and 230. These 2 are younger, but they have significant potential.

Last year, the starters were listed on the roster at 245, 237, and 215. Last year's backers were obviously very good.

This year's backers are very mobile. 3 of the top 4 have played safety at UM. One ran a 10.51 in high school and won the CA state track meet. One played linebacker, and was on the field, as a frosh at Hawaii. He started 1 game. 5 tackles against BYU, 4 against both San Diego St and Nevada. Listed on Hawaii roster at 200.

While not as big, and while lacking experience, their pass defense ought to be better than last year. Their speed and mobility would seem to be a plus against an option running team, as opposed to a power running team. The backers seemed to perform fine against the 1st team offense in spring ball.

Obviously, we'll have to wait and see.

 

[WyomingGrizFan]

...I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air.

Huh,.,so what?

Amongst all the teams in the Big Sky Conference the Griz offense has probably the very best threesome of wide receivers than anyone else. Ellis Henderson and Jamaal Jones are a pair of wideouts that if one is double-teamed the other has single coverage; there is no cornerback in the conference that can cover either Henderson or Jones in one-on-one. Nada.
Did I say threesome?..you got it; Trevan Van comes out of the backfield like another wide receiver. With those three together on the field at the same time either all three or at least one, is going to be under single coverage or none at all. No cornerback in the conference can cover either Henderson, Jones or Van in a one-on-one.
Nada.
Jordy Johnson notices this.


Be afraid. Be aweful-l-ly...awefully afraid.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0cifQL5Q6k[/youtube]

 

[mtgrizrule]

...I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air.

Huh,.,so what?

Amongst all the teams in the Big Sky Conference the Griz offense has probably the very best threesome of wide receivers than anyone else. Ellis Henderson and Jamaal Jones are a pair of wideouts that if one is double-teamed the other has single coverage; there is no cornerback in the conference that can cover either Henderson or Jones in one-on-one. Nada.
Did I say threesome?..you got it; Trevan Van comes out of the backfield like another wide receiver. With those three together on the field at the same time either all three or at least one, is going to be under single coverage or none at all. No cornerback in the conference can cover either Henderson, Jones or Van in a one-on-one.
Nada.
Jordy Johnson notices this.


Be afraid. Be aweful-l-ly...awefully afraid.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0cifQL5Q6k[/youtube]

You'd be right, only if our coaches would listen and learn from you. :thumb:
Seriously, how often do you expect them to get Van in open space on isolation plays?
They did it a few times last season. Too bad got injured and was never 100% again rest of the season.

 

[Rjones61]

...I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air.

Huh,.,so what?

Amongst all the teams in the Big Sky Conference the Griz offense has probably the very best threesome of wide receivers than anyone else. Ellis Henderson and Jamaal Jones are a pair of wideouts that if one is double-teamed the other has single coverage; there is no cornerback in the conference that can cover either Henderson or Jones in one-on-one. Nada.
Did I say threesome?..you got it; Trevan Van comes out of the backfield like another wide receiver. With those three together on the field at the same time either all three or at least one, is going to be under single coverage or none at all. No cornerback in the conference can cover either Henderson, Jones or Van in a one-on-one.
Nada.
Jordy Johnson notices this.


Be afraid. Be aweful-l-ly...awefully afraid.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0cifQL5Q6k[/youtube]

I think I was misunderstood. I know that UM is very capable in the passing game. It's just that UM is very good at spreading defenses thin with the run and pass combo. I am confident that if they forced you to the air, you would still be strong on offense. Just not as strong.

 

[BWahlberg]

...I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air.

Huh,.,so what?

Amongst all the teams in the Big Sky Conference the Griz offense has probably the very best threesome of wide receivers than anyone else. Ellis Henderson and Jamaal Jones are a pair of wideouts that if one is double-teamed the other has single coverage; there is no cornerback in the conference that can cover either Henderson or Jones in one-on-one. Nada.
Did I say threesome?..you got it; Trevan Van comes out of the backfield like another wide receiver. With those three together on the field at the same time either all three or at least one, is going to be under single coverage or none at all. No cornerback in the conference can cover either Henderson, Jones or Van in a one-on-one.
Nada.
Jordy Johnson notices this.


Be afraid. Be aweful-l-ly...awefully afraid.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0cifQL5Q6k[/youtube]

I think I was misunderstood. I know that UM is very capable in the passing game. It's just that UM is very good at spreading defenses thin with the run and pass combo. I am confident that if they forced you to the air, you would still be strong on offense. Just not as strong.

Actually if last year is any indicator the Griz played better, were more proficient, and scored more often when behind in games and in need of going with a pass heavy / hurry up offense.

 

[Rjones61]

...I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air.

Huh,.,so what?

Amongst all the teams in the Big Sky Conference the Griz offense has probably the very best threesome of wide receivers than anyone else. Ellis Henderson and Jamaal Jones are a pair of wideouts that if one is double-teamed the other has single coverage; there is no cornerback in the conference that can cover either Henderson or Jones in one-on-one. Nada.
Did I say threesome?..you got it; Trevan Van comes out of the backfield like another wide receiver. With those three together on the field at the same time either all three or at least one, is going to be under single coverage or none at all. No cornerback in the conference can cover either Henderson, Jones or Van in a one-on-one.
Nada.
Jordy Johnson notices this.


Be afraid. Be aweful-l-ly...awefully afraid.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0cifQL5Q6k[/youtube]

I think I was misunderstood. I know that UM is very capable in the passing game. It's just that UM is very good at spreading defenses thin with the run and pass combo. I am confident that if they forced you to the air, you would still be strong on offense. Just not as strong.

Actually if last year is any indicator the Griz played better, were more proficient, and scored more often when behind in games and in need of going with a pass heavy / hurry up offense.

Very interesting, that is something I hadn't noticed last year. You guys are making a very good case for matching up well with Cal Poly.

 

[Rjones61]

Your position discussions are very solid. They are very well written and interesting, even if they are not for my team. I'm not trying to talk trash, but from reading your position discussions, I am starting to think UM is going to have a tough time with Cal Poly. It sounds like their solid defense will shut down the run, forcing UM to go to the air. Also, Cal Poly being a very run heavy team, I wonder how your new smaller LBs will fair. Again, not trying to trash talk, but how do you think UM fairs against Cal Poly this year?

The UM linebackers are 230/235, 220, 220 and 215 in the top 4. The next two are 235 and 230. These 2 are younger, but they have significant potential.

Last year, the starters were listed on the roster at 245, 237, and 215. Last year's backers were obviously very good.

This year's backers are very mobile. 3 of the top 4 have played safety at UM. One ran a 10.51 in high school and won the CA state track meet. One played linebacker, and was on the field, as a frosh at Hawaii. He started 1 game. 5 tackles against BYU, 4 against both San Diego St and Nevada. Listed on Hawaii roster at 200.

While not as big, and while lacking experience, their pass defense ought to be better than last year. Their speed and mobility would seem to be a plus against an option running team, as opposed to a power running team. The backers seemed to perform fine against the 1st team offense in spring ball.

Obviously, we'll have to wait and see.

Good points, I hadn't really classified Cal Poly's running style when I made the inquiry. I had just thought of them as "run heavy". But now that you bring it up, a speedy linebacker would probably be better for breaking up those type of option offenses. Typically teams try to play a sort of assignment ball on defense and if the players can shed blocks and get to their assignment on time, then theoretically the option team will try to break through that assignment. A speedy linebacker with a good nose for the ball would be able to reach assignments and reach missed assignments as well.

I guess the biggest question with linebackers then is tackle quality and being able to shed blocks. Last year, I remember reading eGrizzers complaining about missed open tackles from their linebackers. So, I guess you would hope that gets corrected.

 

[BWahlberg]

Very interesting, that is something I hadn't noticed last year. You guys are making a very good case for matching up well with Cal Poly.

Let's see, I think the Sac, Poly, South Dakota, EWU, and maybe PSU games saw our power run game totally get stuffed. In most of those the offense had to play either in a shootout or from behind, which lead to more hurry up and quick tempo, and we wound scoring more points and either closing the gap in games, taking the lead, and in many cases (but not all) winning the game.

Come the MSU game the tried their darnedest to go power run which resulted in practically being unable to cross the 50. After giving up a punt return TD the Griz switched it up and spread the ball out more (it seemed) and went on to out score MSU 28-7 over the course of the rest of the game.