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Kraukauer's in Town

I found this sentence from the article interesting:

"In September, Helena District Judge Kathy Seeley ordered the commissioner of higher education to allow Krakauer to inspect the documents he had requested."

I wonder how much of this got into his book and his press. I assume the documents/information had been given to him to inspect under a confidentiality agreement. I wonder if there's an argument that he violated the order by putting some stuff in his book.

By the way, I'm not sure Clay Christian was the final decision maker, as the book indicated. I had heard that the new dean made the final decision. However, I don't know. Just various rumors, some conflicting.
 
PlayerRep said:
I found this sentence from the article interesting:

"In September, Helena District Judge Kathy Seeley ordered the commissioner of higher education to allow Krakauer to inspect the documents he had requested."

I wonder how much of this got into his book and his press. I assume the documents/information had been given to him to inspect under a confidentiality agreement. I wonder if there's an argument that he violated the order by putting some stuff in his book.

Very interesting thought. To find a violation, such stuff would obviously have to be traceable to the reviewed docs/info, assuming a CA or protective order was in place at the time of his review. Granted, I skimmed the book on a cross country flight, but I don't seem to recall much inside info with respect to the admin proceedings. Again, a really interesting question.
 
CDAGRIZ said:
PlayerRep said:
I found this sentence from the article interesting:

"In September, Helena District Judge Kathy Seeley ordered the commissioner of higher education to allow Krakauer to inspect the documents he had requested."

I wonder how much of this got into his book and his press. I assume the documents/information had been given to him to inspect under a confidentiality agreement. I wonder if there's an argument that he violated the order by putting some stuff in his book.

Very interesting thought. To find a violation, such stuff would obviously have to be traceable to the reviewed docs/info, assuming a CA or protective order was in place at the time of his review. Granted, I skimmed the book on a cross country flight, but I don't seem to recall much inside info with respect to the admin proceedings. Again, a really interesting question.

The new information for me was what had occurred after UM had decided to expel him. This decision was in the file released by the federal court in about June that year and there was a letter from Engstrom. After expelling him, Engstrom ends by saying he would miss seeing him play. How dumb was that? After that, I didn't read anything. Just head some rumors. The book had some specifics of what occurred after May/June, and I had never seen or really even heard those specifics. The book also said that Christian had made some final decision, and the accuser couldn't appeal from there, but I heard there was nothing stopping the accuser from appealing. Also, Krakauer said that he had some transcripts or recordings that he wasn't supposed to have. Can't imagine that he would have gotten or seen them this way, and then blatantly violated a court order or agreement, but, I don't know anything about what Krakauer may have gotten in that regard.
 
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.
 
CDAGRIZ said:
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.

Second book. Though it has already been used, the new working title for the next volume includes the phrase " I'm back for more cash."
 
CDAGRIZ said:
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.

I think he is set on convicting Johnson. This is what drives him. He's obsessed. I believe he said something in his "public forum" (gag) about him being the only one on the jury that would have found Jordan guilty if he was on it. All of his time and research and effort was wasted.....his book became a flop the second the words "not guilty" were uttered in that courtroom. I guarantee you that burns him to no end and he won't let it go. Obviously JJ can't be retried again in a court setting but if Krakauer thinks there is anyway of convicting him through the words in his book he's gonna do it. Revisions....revisions.....revisions. More public appearances etc.....He'll keep poking the fire until he believes he has won because at this point he is a big loser.

You may laugh, but I think it's as simple as that.
 
mtgrizrule said:
WTH? This is some lame ass reporting by the Missoulian, yet again.
Multiple university proceedings found Johnson guilty of rape, but Commissioner Clay Christian, also named in the lawsuit, vacated the findings, according to Krakauer's most recent book. "Missoula: Rape and the Justice System in a College Town" was released in April. He was not found guilty of rape in those proceedings.
Krakauer and the Missoulian are, literally, asking for a defamation suit. I hope they get it.
 
signedbewildered said:
CDAGRIZ said:
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.

I think he is set on convicting Johnson. This is what drives him. He's obsessed. I believe he said something in his "public forum" (gag) about him being the only one on the jury that would have found Jordan guilty if he was on it. All of his time and research and effort was wasted.....his book became a flop the second the words "not guilty" were uttered in that courtroom. I guarantee you that burns him to no end and he won't let it go. Obviously JJ can't be retried again in a court setting but if Krakauer thinks there is anyway of convicting him through the words in his book he's gonna do it. Revisions....revisions.....revisions. More public appearances etc.....He'll keep poking the fire until he believes he has won because at this point he is a big loser.

You may laugh, but I think it's as simple as that.

I think you are exactly right. He did the same thing in his book Into the Wild. Expert after expert disclaimed his theory that some sort of berry caused the dude's death. He kept searching for an expert that would finally adopt his theory and then that became the truth of his book.
 
CDAGRIZ said:
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.

He has said he will update the book when/if the information is released. I can't imagine that the information will get released, due to the federal student privacy laws and the apparent position of the feds, unless the involved student or student consents to release. I don't know if the accuser also has privacy rights in this situation. Everyone seems talk as if it's only the accused's right, but why wouldn't it also be the accuser's right. Maybe she has indicated she would consent. If JJ were to ever bring a claim in court, and I don't know what the statute of limitations would be, the information would have to be made public.
 
signedbewildered said:
CDAGRIZ said:
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.

I think he is set on convicting Johnson. This is what drives him. He's obsessed. I believe he said something in his "public forum" (gag) about him being the only one on the jury that would have found Jordan guilty if he was on it. All of his time and research and effort was wasted.....his book became a flop the second the words "not guilty" were uttered in that courtroom. I guarantee you that burns him to no end and he won't let it go. Obviously JJ can't be retried again in a court setting but if Krakauer thinks there is anyway of convicting him through the words in his book he's gonna do it. Revisions....revisions.....revisions. More public appearances etc.....He'll keep poking the fire until he believes he has won because at this point he is a big loser.

You may laugh, but I think it's as simple as that.

I'm not laughing. I pretty much agree with you.
 
I hesitate to post, as ignoring Krakauer, as everyone else in the world is apparently doing, (outside of Missoula and NY Publishers) is the only sane way to deal with him and his book.

Last time I look at any thread with his name or this subject, unless and until civil suits are filed.
 
PlayerRep said:
signedbewildered said:
CDAGRIZ said:
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.

I think he is set on convicting Johnson. This is what drives him. He's obsessed. I believe he said something in his "public forum" (gag) about him being the only one on the jury that would have found Jordan guilty if he was on it. All of his time and research and effort was wasted.....his book became a flop the second the words "not guilty" were uttered in that courtroom. I guarantee you that burns him to no end and he won't let it go. Obviously JJ can't be retried again in a court setting but if Krakauer thinks there is anyway of convicting him through the words in his book he's gonna do it. Revisions....revisions.....revisions. More public appearances etc.....He'll keep poking the fire until he believes he has won because at this point he is a big loser.

You may laugh, but I think it's as simple as that.

I'm not laughing. I pretty much agree with you.

I would love to see some civil action against him. I would like to think Paoli would love to take it on. Maybe JJ just wants to put that chapter of his life in the rear view mirror.
 
getgrizzy said:
PlayerRep said:
Wonder why he's here. Could he be dating one of the accusers?
Yeah, you're not a win at all costs fan. :roll:

What does asking a question about Krakauer have to do with being a win-at-all-costs fan? You are an odd duck.
 
PlayerRep said:
Wonder why he's here. Could he be dating one of the accusers?

I thought this was a rhetorical question...figured he was sitting next to you, both of you giggling while sitting in your tighty whiteys just waiting for people to take the bait...
 
bgbigdog said:
CDAGRIZ said:
Good info. I wonder why he would still be pursuing the ultimate release of the info when the book has been released for months. The financial stuff seems to be sorted, so what is the motivation? Second edition? Or, ratification of previous inclusion of information? Maybe I'm over-thinking something for the first time ever.

This could ultimately become another cereal thread. May our children forgive us.

Second book. Though it has already been used, the new working title for the next volume includes the phrase " I'm back for more cash."


Who here has actually read the book? I'm a former player, alum and father of one female student with a second one headed that way. As a family, we purchased one copy, read it and passed it to the next. I'm not going to give a full review here, and don't believe it to be an outstanding book by any means. In general, my take on it is that he takes a lot of conjecture and provides only the facts that support his view. I wouldn't say he mis represents facts, but certainly puts his spin on it.

I played for Larry Donovan and fortunately, Don Read. It was a very different time in Grizzly football. As an example, my daughter dated two players, one of which is a major contributor, while the other is a further down the depth chart. Both were very respectful when met, but my daughter confided in the simple fact that when around campus one was very different. Of her own violation, she doesn't date either of them any longer, doesn't speak ill of them and still has some limited contact with them. However, she just mentioned the team in general has an attitude. But in her defense, she did say a lot of the other teams have attitudes as well and as with any group like that, some of which is to be expected. I pointed out that even when I played, and we weren't a 1/4 of the deal the team is now, we had bravado and could be exclusive. But, I also didn't live in a instant media world back then. Things happened, and word didn't get out. To me, the team is being scrutinized at a high level and there is a medium in place to immediately publish any transgression. That being said, it doesn't justify unacceptable behavior.

The overwhelming theme in the book is binge drinking and impaired choices. Secondly, in general our lack of acknowledgement that rape isn't limited to an unknown assailant in a dark alley. I wish I had the answers, because it keeps me awake at night sometimes when I think of my two girls out there. No woman deserves to be raped, we all understand that and I think would agree with that premise. If I really believed Missoula was any worse then any other similar institution, I would not have allowed my girls to attend. The bottom line was there was increased publicity and it provided the vehicle for his book and he is going to ride it until it is out of gas.
 

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