THE REAL STORY FROM JR's DAD

[ilovethecats]

so I have a question. and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post. but does any kid, right or wrong, truth or lie, have a chance using the brownie excuse in these matters? I am truly curious about this.

it just seems to me that if this flies, then any player on any team forever could use it. and why stop brownies? what would keep a player from toking up, getting caught, and then saying they must have accidently ingested it in their crackers? or cheese? or mints? or gum? just seems like it's a slippery slope and i'm curious what you guys think.

fwiw, I think they need to legalize it already and this wouldn't be an issue. though i'd assume that most of the coaches in the country wouldn't allow it during the season just as many don't allow drinking.

 

[EverettGriz]

and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post

Mods??

 

[EverettGriz]

so I have a question. and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post. but does any kid, right or wrong, truth or lie, have a chance using the brownie excuse in these matters? I am truly curious about this.

it just seems to me that if this flies, then any player on any team forever could use it. and why stop brownies? what would keep a player from toking up, getting caught, and then saying they must have accidently ingested it in their crackers? or cheese? or mints? or gum? just seems like it's a slippery slope and i'm curious what you guys think.

fwiw, I think they need to legalize it already and this wouldn't be an issue. though i'd assume that most of the coaches in the country wouldn't allow it during the season just as many don't allow drinking.

My guess -- and it's purely a guess -- is that if it's used, it will be used to reduce the suspension, not get it thrown out completely.

 

[ilovethecats]

and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post

Mods??

:lol:

 

[ilovethecats]

so I have a question. and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post. but does any kid, right or wrong, truth or lie, have a chance using the brownie excuse in these matters? I am truly curious about this.

it just seems to me that if this flies, then any player on any team forever could use it. and why stop brownies? what would keep a player from toking up, getting caught, and then saying they must have accidently ingested it in their crackers? or cheese? or mints? or gum? just seems like it's a slippery slope and i'm curious what you guys think.

fwiw, I think they need to legalize it already and this wouldn't be an issue. though i'd assume that most of the coaches in the country wouldn't allow it during the season just as many don't allow drinking.

My guess -- and it's purely a guess -- is that if it's used, it will be used to reduce the suspension, not get it thrown out completely.

this would make sense to me. however, anyone could continue to use this excuse right? if there is no way of knowing the difference between it being inhaled or accidently ingested, and a player got a reduced suspension after saying he accidently ingested it, won't every player in the nation who likes to smoke a doobie do the same thing?

wouldn't this be like a player getting a dui and saying he had no idea he was drinking alcohol because all he drank was punch and didn't know it was spiked? then he could get a few buddies to agree that he had no clue it was spiked. and his dad could come on a message board and say he knows for a fact his son didn't know the punch was spiked because his son told him so. then a bunch of idiots on a message board could argue back and forth on whether or not you can in fact taste alcohol when it is added to punch.

 

[EverettGriz]

Yep, I agree ILTC, it's somewhat of a slippery slope for the NCAA. However, I think there are two pieces to this that may make it different than a normal positive test. To begin with, it was following a tournament game, hence the 6 week ban. In most instances, I would guess positive tests wouldn't lead to such a lengthy punishment. The second issue, assuming you take the OP's post at face value, is that there would appear to be in this instance people who are willing to corroborate JR's story with sworn testimony. That may be difficult to produce in most instances with positive tests.

 

[Grisly Fan]

so I have a question. and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post. but does any kid, right or wrong, truth or lie, have a chance using the brownie excuse in these matters? I am truly curious about this.

it just seems to me that if this flies, then any player on any team forever could use it. and why stop brownies? what would keep a player from toking up, getting caught, and then saying they must have accidently ingested it in their crackers? or cheese? or mints? or gum? just seems like it's a slippery slope and i'm curious what you guys think.

fwiw, I think they need to legalize it already and this wouldn't be an issue. though i'd assume that most of the coaches in the country wouldn't allow it during the season just as many don't allow drinking.

My guess -- and it's purely a guess -- is that if it's used, it will be used to reduce the suspension, not get it thrown out completely.

this would make sense to me. however, anyone could continue to use this excuse right? if there is no way of knowing the difference between it being inhaled or accidently ingested, and a player got a reduced suspension after saying he accidently ingested it, won't every player in the nation who likes to smoke a doobie do the same thing?

wouldn't this be like a player getting a dui and saying he had no idea he was drinking alcohol because all he drank was punch and didn't know it was spiked? then he could get a few buddies to agree that he had no clue it was spiked. and his dad could come on a message board and say he knows for a fact his son didn't know the punch was spiked because his son told him so. then a bunch of idiots on a message board could argue back and forth on whether or not you can in fact taste alcohol when it is added to punch.

You seem to suggest that there can be no such thing as "extenuating circumstances" in this case. I would counter that there are always cases that don't fit the mold for which the rules were made. Is this one? I haven't a clue but to assert it is always cut and dried is a mistake. I'll use a recent personal experience to illustrate. My Father-in-Law, 85 yrs old attempted to strangle his 84 yr old wife so he could be "free". He is a severe dementia patient who had his psychiatric medicine regiment adjusted causing him to have insomnia for 3 days. His paraplegic wife was nagging him to get out of bed. He reached over and grabbed her throat. She managed to call for help. He was arrested and charged with attempted second degree murder. At the hospital where they were both taken after the incident I asked him if he tried to kill his wife and he said yes. I asked him why he would hurt his wife? He said that he loves his wife and would never hurt her. Over-charged obviously and the real hurt would have happened if he had a prior anything then Measure 11 in Oregon would have led to a mandatory 11 year prison sentence. My point in all this is that you should always be open to reviewing the facts before you convict anyone of wrong doing. BTW - The case was plead to a class A misdemeanor and 5 years probation and live apart from his spouse. The real victim is my bank account down $35K for attorney's fees...

 

[ilovethecats]

so I have a question. and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post. but does any kid, right or wrong, truth or lie, have a chance using the brownie excuse in these matters? I am truly curious about this.

it just seems to me that if this flies, then any player on any team forever could use it. and why stop brownies? what would keep a player from toking up, getting caught, and then saying they must have accidently ingested it in their crackers? or cheese? or mints? or gum? just seems like it's a slippery slope and i'm curious what you guys think.

fwiw, I think they need to legalize it already and this wouldn't be an issue. though i'd assume that most of the coaches in the country wouldn't allow it during the season just as many don't allow drinking.

My guess -- and it's purely a guess -- is that if it's used, it will be used to reduce the suspension, not get it thrown out completely.

this would make sense to me. however, anyone could continue to use this excuse right? if there is no way of knowing the difference between it being inhaled or accidently ingested, and a player got a reduced suspension after saying he accidently ingested it, won't every player in the nation who likes to smoke a doobie do the same thing?

wouldn't this be like a player getting a dui and saying he had no idea he was drinking alcohol because all he drank was punch and didn't know it was spiked? then he could get a few buddies to agree that he had no clue it was spiked. and his dad could come on a message board and say he knows for a fact his son didn't know the punch was spiked because his son told him so. then a bunch of idiots on a message board could argue back and forth on whether or not you can in fact taste alcohol when it is added to punch.

You seem to suggest that there can be no such thing as "extenuating circumstances" in this case. I would counter that there are always cases that don't fit the mold for which the rules were made. Is this one? I haven't a clue but to assert it is always cut and dried is a mistake. I'll use a recent personal experience to illustrate. My Father-in-Law, 85 yrs old attempted to strangle his 84 yr old wife so he could be "free". He is a severe dementia patient who had his psychiatric medicine regiment adjusted causing him to have insomnia for 3 days. His paraplegic wife was nagging him to get out of bed. He reached over and grabbed her throat. She managed to call for help. He was arrested and charged with attempted second degree murder. At the hospital where they were both taken after the incident I asked him if he tried to kill his wife and he said yes. I asked him why he would hurt his wife? He said that he loves his wife and would never hurt her. Over-charged obviously and the real hurt would have happened if he had a prior anything then Measure 11 in Oregon would have led to a mandatory 11 year prison sentence. My point in all this is that you should always be open to reviewing the facts before you convict anyone of wrong doing. BTW - The case was plead to a class A misdemeanor and 5 years probation and live apart from his spouse. The real victim is my bank account down $35K for attorney's fees...

wow, that was some story! sorry you had to deal with something like that.

to be clear I wasn intending to say that everything should be cut and dried. obviously every situation is different. i'm merely saying that in THIS case, if it really is as easy as saying "I didn't smoke, I just accidently ate brownies with weed", what will keep every pot smoking athlete from doing the same?

it just seems to me that this is going to be one of those things where they are going to have to be hard on the athlete no matter what. in some cases the athlete might get screwed over because they really did accidently ingest drugs. but it seems like the only way to actually be able to punish the guys knowingly doing the drugs.

and like I said before I think the punishment is ridiculous. but that is a different story all together. as of this minute weed is still illegal whether I like it or not. as of right now players will face consequnces for having it in their system. so I just don't see how the ncaa would simply agree to the excuse that a player had no idea he was using the drug. it's just too easy and more importantly; too easy to copy.

 

[UMGriz75]

His paraplegic wife was nagging him to get out of bed. He reached over and grabbed her throat. She managed to call for help. He was arrested and charged with attempted second degree murder. At the hospital where they were both taken after the incident I asked him if he tried to kill his wife and he said yes. I asked him why he would hurt his wife? He said that he loves his wife and would never hurt her.

One of the horrible side-effects of dementia is often inexplicable rages and violence. That follows explicable rages when someone knows they are losing their memory. I've got a client right now in early stages, and he will often rage, after changing his mind on some key point, that "why won't anyone listen to me?" He doesn't remember that he told us to take the opposite position just two weeks before.

I understand Glen Campbell is now in similar, violent, stages.

But those really aren't "extenuating" circumstances. With JR, presumably an intelligent, socially aware young man, he may have genuinely thought, "sometimes a Brownie is just a Brownie," to paraphrase Freud.

But, the real "extenuating" circumstance is the overwrought suspension. Who was the NCAA really mad at?

 

[getgrizzy]

iltc: JR's battle with the NCAA requires that he provide documentation that he was unaware that he was eating a laced brownie. The person that laced them apparently confessed to doing it and has owned up to someone in authority, which must be UM or the police or the NCAA. Not sure what all is involved in doing this. Maybe all parties will have to take a lie detector test.

So it's much more involved that just saying you didn't know.

 

[getgrizzy]

His paraplegic wife was nagging him to get out of bed. He reached over and grabbed her throat. She managed to call for help. He was arrested and charged with attempted second degree murder. At the hospital where they were both taken after the incident I asked him if he tried to kill his wife and he said yes. I asked him why he would hurt his wife? He said that he loves his wife and would never hurt her.

One of the horrible side-effects of dementia is often inexplicable rages and violence. That follows explicable rages when someone knows they are losing their memory. I've got a client right now in early stages, and he will often rage, after changing his mind on some key point, that "why won't anyone listen to me?" He doesn't remember that he told us to take the opposite position just two weeks before.

I understand Glen Campbell is now in similar, violent, stages.

But those really aren't "extenuating" circumstances. With JR, presumably an intelligent, socially aware young man, he may have genuinely thought, "sometimes a Brownie is just a Brownie," to paraphrase Freud.

But, the real "extenuating" circumstance is the overwrought suspension. Who was the NCAA really mad at?

The NCAA suspension was just lowered to half a season from a full season about three years ago, so it isn't like they're upping the suspension because of whatever special reason it is that you're thinking of.

 

[MrTitleist]

and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post

Mods??

:ban:

 

[ilovethecats]

and my apologies for asking something that pertains to the original post

Mods??

:ban:

well shit!

 

[WildThingsMT]

Funny that all these Grizzly fans are talking about getting this Nelson kid out of here but then they recruit a kid who got arrested at a party. Maybe you guys should start blaming the coaches for who they recruit and not the these trouble making kids. Grizzly fans never change. Anyways, I know Coach Gregorak would love to have Nelson on the team in Bozeman even though he isn't that good and will only play half the year, Coach knows he's reliable when he's out there. Plus a former Grizzly player playing for the BobCats would be just what the Griz need to get what's coming to them. FTG!!

 

[grizd]

Funny that all these Grizzly fans are talking about getting this Nelson kid out of here but then they recruit a kid who got arrested at a party. Maybe you guys should start blaming the coaches for who they recruit and not the these trouble making kids. Grizzly fans never change. Anyways, I know Coach Gregorak would love to have Nelson on the team in Bozeman even though he isn't that good and will only play half the year, Coach knows he's reliable when he's out there. Plus a former Grizzly player playing for the BobCats would be just what the Griz need to get what's coming to them. FTG!!

I know State prides itself on math and science but is it too much to ask to teach some language arts? I am also perplexed why a self proclaimed BobCat fan would spell it that way. You are right about Coach Gregorak. He would love Nelson on his team, particularly given the stellar CB play the BobCats had last year. I can't wait to see what's coming to us actually, I've been hearing about it for quite some time.

 

[UMGriz75]

Funny that all these Grizzly fans are talking about getting this Nelson kid out of here but then they recruit a kid who got arrested at a party. Maybe you guys should start blaming the coaches for who they recruit and not the these trouble making kids. Grizzly fans never change.

Bobcat fans will never be able to speak to this with any credibility. UM has never had to deal with a murder in a cornfield, a meth operation, or a drug network.

 

[ilovethecats]

Maybe you guys should start blaming the coaches for who they recruit and not these trouble making kids.

this is the dumbest fucking thing I have ever read and is exactly what's wrong with kids today. jesus.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Maybe you guys should start blaming the coaches for who they recruit and not these trouble making kids.

this is the dumbest fucking thing I have ever read and is exactly what's wrong with kids today. jesus.

He's one of yours, ILTC. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[ilovethecats]

Maybe you guys should start blaming the coaches for who they recruit and not these trouble making kids.

this is the dumbest f***[*] thing I have ever read and is exactly what's wrong with kids today. jesus.

He's one of yours, ILTC. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I know.

but you have growler so... :shit:

 

[EverettGriz]

Funny that all these Grizzly fans are talking about getting this Nelson kid out of here but then they recruit a kid who got arrested at a party. Maybe you guys should start blaming the coaches for who they recruit and not the these trouble making kids. Grizzly fans never change. Anyways, I know Coach Gregorak would love to have Nelson on the team in Bozeman even though he isn't that good and will only play half the year, Coach knows he's reliable when he's out there. Plus a former Grizzly player playing for the BobCats would be just what the Griz need to get what's coming to them. FTG!!

Please, prior to ever posting in a public forum again, seek out a Remedial English course at a junior college near you.