McDowell back in the portal

[Znelson15]

Real deal Here is McDowell is gone and done, he left the team and culture and a winning team to better himself. Did it back fire yes but if I grinded on this Griz team with him last year and he just bounced like he did while everyone else was committed to what the Griz have going (had a lot better players who could of transfered out but didn't)

I wouldn't want him back as a teammate, we keep saying coaches don't want him back but what about players and teammates. He bailed on them and they have been working just as hard or if not harder to better the Griz program and are sticking around.

Let's not forget he was the only person to want to transfer out of our returning starters, that says something about what we have going right now and I'm all for it

The fact cliff has a thread this long still blows my mind but also just shows we need the spring game to get here.......

 

[CDAGRIZ]

IMO, the "some" are wrong.

Fair enough. There are many entities that have stuck with their ways when industries have changed. Can I interest you in a Radio Shack or Blockbuster Video franchise?

 

[uofmman1122]

Real deal Here is McDowell is gone and done, he left the team and culture and a winning team to better himself. Did it back fire yes but if I grinded on this Griz team with him last year and he just bounced like he did while everyone else was committed to what the Griz have going (had a lot better players who could of transfered out but didn't)

I wouldn't want him back as a teammate, we keep saying coaches don't want him back but what about players and teammates. He bailed on them and they have been working just as hard or if not harder to better the Griz program and are sticking around.

Let's not forget he was the only person to want to transfer out of our returning starters, that says something about what we have going right now and I'm all for it

The fact cliff has a thread this long still blows my mind but also just shows we need the spring game to get here.......

On one hand, I definitely feel you, and I'm sure that's where the coaches are coming from and why they didn't allow him to come back.

On the other, though, he was pretty beloved in the locker room, so I doubt many of the players would be super upset if he were to somehow come back and want to compete again.

I think it's pretty understandable for a thread on a guy who was one of only 8 Griz QBs to ever lead us to a national championship to get traction on here, but that's just me.

 

[mthoopsfan]

Real deal Here is McDowell is gone and done, he left the team and culture and a winning team to better himself. Did it back fire yes but if I grinded on this Griz team with him last year and he just bounced like he did while everyone else was committed to what the Griz have going (had a lot better players who could of transfered out but didn't)

I wouldn't want him back as a teammate, we keep saying coaches don't want him back but what about players and teammates. He bailed on them and they have been working just as hard or if not harder to better the Griz program and are sticking around.

Let's not forget he was the only person to want to transfer out of our returning starters, that says something about what we have going right now and I'm all for it

The fact cliff has a thread this long still blows my mind but also just shows we need the spring game to get here.......

Good point and good post. A starter told me what you said in the first week after McDowell departed. He basically said goodbye (almost good riddance), next man up, and Griz will be fine. I wonder if his teammates didn't love him.

 

[mthoopsfan]

On one hand, I definitely feel you, and I'm sure that's where the coaches are coming from and why they didn't allow him to come back.

On the other, though, he was pretty beloved in the locker room, so I doubt many of the players would be super upset if he were to somehow come back and want to compete again.

I think it's pretty understandable for a thread on a guy who was one of only 8 Griz QBs to ever lead us to a national championship to get traction on here, but that's just me.

My impression was that he was NOT beloved in the locker room.

Here's what a parent told me when McDowell departed: "Doesn’t shock me, felt he didn’t fit, we will be better off".

My text to a player after McDowell left: "I don’t think coaches ever had full confidence in McDowell. He wasn’t great in last 3 games. He was good and improved, but we can do better."

Response: "I agree. We will be better."

 

[uofmman1122]

My impression was that he was NOT beloved in the locker room.

Here's what a parent told me when McDowell departed: "Doesn’t shock me, felt he didn’t fit, we will be better off".

My text to a player after McDowell left: "I don’t think coaches ever had full confidence in McDowell. He wasn’t great in last 3 games. He was good and improved, but we can do better."

Response: "I agree. We will be better."

I dunno, I heard from several offensive players that he was one of their favorite teammates, and the dynamic of the team, especially on offense, completely changed after he took over for the better. I'm sure not every player felt that way, but I didn't get the sense at all that he didn't fit in.

I could see how his last 3 games may have changed some opinions, though. I heard some 2nd hand frustrations they and the coaches had with him passing up running lanes that he had taken all year in order to force throws downfield.

I do agree that we can do better, though, and I hope whoever gets the job this year is a step in that direction.

 

[HelenaHandBasket]

Fair enough. There are many entities that have stuck with their ways when industries have changed. Can I interest you in a Radio Shack or Blockbuster Video franchise?

Just because they didn't let a guy return that entered the portal doesn't mean that they haven't evolved. You are stuck on a single minimal issue making it sound like the end is near unless they change.

 

[EverettGriz]

This is likely a broader statement than is warranted on this thread, but I'm going to make it because it does dovetail into the overall theme here.

In the NFL, you hear the phrase "It's a business" all the time. As in, "I understand the decision. It's a business, after all". Guys leave and return to teams all the time. Consider Mecole Hardman. He left the Chiefs as a FA and got paid. KC would have loved to have kept him, but they understood his decision to test the market; it's a business after all.

When things didn't work out with the Jets, the Chiefs gave up draft capital to get him back, because they saw that he could help the team, and it was worth the draft pick given up; it's a business after all. Fast forward a few months and Hardman is catching the game-winner in the SB.

College programs are going to have to adopt more of the "it's a business, after all" approach to their decision-making. The old-school model of "if they don't want to be here, eff 'em" concept is not likely to work in a post-NIL environment. Schools need to begin considering this a business, and understanding that players have more options now, and leaving doesn't necessarily mean that player is no longer committed. College football truly IS a business after all.

 

[mthoopsfan]

This is likely a broader statement than is warranted on this thread, but I'm going to make it because it does dovetail into the overall theme here.

In the NFL, you hear the phrase "It's a business" all the time. As in, "I understand the decision. It's a business, after all". Guys leave and return to teams all the time. Consider Mecole Hardman. He left the Chiefs as a FA and got paid. KC would have loved to have kept him, but they understood his decision to test the market; it's a business after all.

When things didn't work out with the Jets, the Chiefs gave up draft capital to get him back, because they saw that he could help the team, and it was worth the draft pick given up; it's a business after all. Fast forward a few months and Hardman is catching the game-winner in the SB.

College programs are going to have to adopt more of the "it's a business, after all" approach to their decision-making. The old-school model of "if they don't want to be here, eff 'em" concept is not likely to work in a post-NIL environment. Schools need to begin considering this a business, and understanding that players have more options now, and leaving doesn't necessarily mean that player is no longer committed. College football truly IS a business after all.

NFL players don’t have a Portal. They are under contract. They leave only after their contract has not been renewed. Of course, they can be traded, but that is not because they decided to leave and left on their own.

Silly comparison. Not applicable.

 

[HelenaHandBasket]

This is likely a broader statement than is warranted on this thread, but I'm going to make it because it does dovetail into the overall theme here.

In the NFL, you hear the phrase "It's a business" all the time. As in, "I understand the decision. It's a business, after all". Guys leave and return to teams all the time. Consider Mecole Hardman. He left the Chiefs as a FA and got paid. KC would have loved to have kept him, but they understood his decision to test the market; it's a business after all.

When things didn't work out with the Jets, the Chiefs gave up draft capital to get him back, because they saw that he could help the team, and it was worth the draft pick given up; it's a business after all. Fast forward a few months and Hardman is catching the game-winner in the SB.

College programs are going to have to adopt more of the "it's a business, after all" approach to their decision-making. The old-school model of "if they don't want to be here, eff 'em" concept is not likely to work in a post-NIL environment. Schools need to begin considering this a business, and understanding that players have more options now, and leaving doesn't necessarily mean that player is no longer committed. College football truly IS a business after all.

I think your error is comparing the NFL business model with the college business model. They are different. If a scholarship player enters the portal with intent to leave and the school uses that scholarship to replace him, then you can't bring him back with a scholarship. Even though the NFL has limits, they are different limits that have much more flexibility.

 

[EverettGriz]

NFL players don’t have a Portal. They are under contract. They leave only after their contract has not been renewed. Of course, they can be traded, but that is not because they decided to leave and left on their own.

Silly comparison. Not applicable.

Uhhh, when their contract ends (or when a team simply releases them mid-contract), they become FAs. If anything, you're strengthening my argument, because college players are FAs from day one. So college programs need to start thinking that way.

Apologies if this is conceptually difficult for some.

 

[EverettGriz]

I think your error is comparing the NFL business model with the college business model. They are different. If a scholarship player enters the portal with intent to leave and the school uses that scholarship to replace him, then you can't bring him back with a scholarship. Even though the NFL has limits, they are different limits that have much more flexibility.

Okay, I see and agree with this argument. Obviously if there isn't a scholarship available, a guy ain't comin' back. But I think those of us suggesting that it's okay to take players who left back are doing so with the understanding that a scholarship is available (in fact, I made that very statement earlier in this thread).

 

[HelenaHandBasket]

Okay, I see and agree with this argument. Obviously if there isn't a scholarship available, a guy ain't comin' back. But I think those of us suggesting that it's okay to take players who left back are doing so with the understanding that a scholarship is available (in fact, I made that very statement earlier in this thread).

My take is this will happen at a low percentage and that in most cases a coach can find a comparable player to fill the void. I think people are making a mountain out of a mole hill on this topic and Hauck's stance on this will not make or break the program. It might be okay, but throughout college football, it is rare for a player to enter the portal and be welcomed back by the same staff.

 

[HelenaHandBasket]

I also believe that most coaches feel the same, but Hauck is one of the few that has said the quiet part out loud.

 

[mthoopsfan]

Uhhh, when their contract ends (or when a team simply releases them mid-contract), they become FAs. If anything, you're strengthening my argument, because college players are FAs from day one. So college programs need to start thinking that way.

Apologies if this is conceptually difficult for some.

I was a contract lawyer for 45 years. Sorry if you don’t understand college football.

 

[ElrodGrizzly]

Guys, just gotta commend everyone here. This is genuinely the most decent and reasonably argued thread I've ever seen on Egriz. Lots of points made, and some I agree with one both sides. No hatefulness or attacks. With as ugly as this place has been not that long ago, this conversation genuinely makes me happy whether I agree with parts of it or not. Good on you all.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Just because they didn't let a guy return that entered the portal doesn't mean that they haven't evolved. You are stuck on a single minimal issue making it sound like the end is near unless they change.

No. I'm not saying the end is near for failure to adapt. I'm saying the same is near, but better might be available in the long run if we do adapt. No program at our level of FB disrupts anything by remaining the same in a changing landscape. I'm only saying that we could maybe find a way to be on the cutting edge of the new stuff and gain an advantage. The Clif situation is just an example.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Also, I have a general question: CBB players can declare for the NBA Draft early and then change their minds before the deadline. Has there been CBB coach who said "no" to someone who withdraws his name and wants to come back (absent other issues)? Clearly, the player must have borderline NBA talent to even declare, right? So that's a pretty good thing to have back on the college team. What if an FCS football program treated it the same way (replacing NBA with FBS)?

 

[MissoulaMarinerFan]

NFL players don’t have a Portal. They are under contract. They leave only after their contract has not been renewed. Of course, they can be traded, but that is not because they decided to leave and left on their own.

Silly comparison. Not applicable.

I understand what hoops is saying here - the other reality of it is, yes, it isn't like the professional job market, but as a working professional (caveats of non-compete agreements, etc.) folks leave/transistion to a different job for a pay increase all the time.

Not saying it works in all cases or I agree with what the portal has done, but to my very amateur, un-trained eye, it appears some are leaving for a pay increase when they can get it. Why wouldn't they go somewhere to get paid (sometimes significantly more) for doing the same thing? Again, not saying I agree with it, just commenting on some of what I've seen.

Of course, that is just 1 slice of the bigger pie, but that's how I'm viewing some of it.

 

[MissoulaMarinerFan]

No. I'm not saying the end is near for failure to adapt. I'm saying the same is near, but better might be available in the long run if we do adapt. No program at our level of FB disrupts anything by remaining the same in a changing landscape. I'm only saying that we could maybe find a way to be on the cutting edge of the new stuff and gain an advantage. The Clif situation is just an example.

Yeah, but even that gets tricky based on when the portal opens and when signing days happen. I'd imagine the timing would have to be right for this as well (i.e goes into portal after signing day (so his scholarship is already "counted" and could potentially be given back).

I would think at FCS level, there would even need to be extenuating circumstances to make it work. Say they wanted to bring him back. Could they? Probably no scholly's open (depending on when the portal entry happened). Would Clif be willing to walk on? If yes, NIL wouldn't help because Clif would be an everyday student. Would he be willing or able to pay his own way?

Not disagreeing with you, just pointing out there are a truckload of more logistics to figure out even if both the staff and the player want to come back. Which is probably why for FCS for the most part, once you're in the portal, there isn't turning back around.

I'm all for trying to find advantages on the edges - but I don't know due to the limited scholarships and funding that is typical for the FCS level there is a way. I'd be curious to know if there were a way to take an advantage - I just don't know where that would be (right now).