Faculty ask for reconsideration of Hauck hire

[grizpsych]

... Fortunately, I got out of teaching (evening classes/mostly graduate) before "grade inflation" started to creep into the sciences. Now, grades mean nothing as to the knowledge and competence of the student. In fact, I was totally shocked to see (in an older US News &WP article) that "more than 40 percent of all grades awarded were in the A range" among a survey sample of 200 colleges and universities. https://www.usnews.com/opinion/blog...inflation-is-a-real-problem-and-how-to-fix-it

That is total bulls**t! With that, any yoo-yoo should be able to end up with a GPA over 3.5 -- even if they never crack a book. My friends who are still in the supervisory workforce tell me, flat-out, that they pay no attention to the GPA any more. One lady said she interviewed an applicant who had a straight-A record. But a half-dozen easy questions indicated that this graduate (won't mention the school) had significant skill/knowledge gaps in the field where he had supposedly earned a B.S. degree.

So any criteria based on grades attained is probably totally worthless -- too many "A's" handed out as participation ribbons.

Edit: Yes, for undergraduate classes I did "grade on the curve."

Grade inflation is so bad now. From a different perspective, I don't inflate grades and I don't curve. The amount of supposed "A" students whining to me that they cannot believe they are getting a C in my courses is outstanding. My usual reply is welcome to a real college course.

Glad to hear there are still pockets of sanity ... wish there more more. I don't suppose you get glowing reviews in those "faculty evaluations" complied by the student body.

Actually, I get pretty good reviews. It's probably because I do drop their lowest exam scores which includes the final. Plus, I do the reviews in person. So all of the slackers that are not in class don't get to review. :thumb:

 

[first11]

Twisted knickers all around

 

[bgbigdog]

She said the email didn't make a physical threat, but "it reads pretty threatening." She said the email told the signers they should be more focused on their jobs than on Hauck...."
........

If this is true Kent, how the hell does this happen? Allowing folks from your team to pour gas on this fire isn’t great management or leadership.
.......

I don't know exactly what was said/written/shared. Odd that she wasn't more specific. Remember a certain group of people absolutely LOVE to use words like threatening, scared, intimidated, harassing, victim.

Just sayin'.

You know if there had been no email, that short paragraph wouldn’t have contributed to the delirium. Just sayin...

And if there was no letter there would likely have been no email.

So they brought it on themselves? If this is true, this is the story of the guy who threw second punch, then points the finger of a victim, saying he started it. All the email did was help to validate their contention, but keep believing that people are going to be able to view this from a few steps back and understand what went on.

Appear weak when you are strong, and strong when you are weak.” “The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting.” “If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles.

In any institutional transition of leadership, (two or more of them going on right now), it’s likely that some group of disgruntled employees will raise questions about issues with the underlying theme being “we aren’t being listened to.” The Hauck uprising is only a prelude to this group spending a lot of time telling Bodnar, when he is finally seated, what’s wrong & what he can do for them to fix it. This thing, that really isn’t a thing - but a signal, that they’re going to be heard. I have no doubt that Bodnar knows what to do, and you can bet someone on his staff won’t be sending email gasoline. And he won’t be working to “help them to become gruntled again.”

 

[MTGRIZ12]

FTF

 

[bearister]

A lot of names on this list with gender identity issues. Just sayin'.

Edit: Should also point out many of those names enjoyed the game from R. Engstrom's box. And I quote "I don't know a first down from a (insert big animal here) down, but the booze was great!!!"

“Gender identity issues”? Please connect this bigoted remark.


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[bearister]

I'm so confused these days. I'll post a quote (many more like it) from this thread but not attribute it.

Once again the far left libtards don't look at the whole picture before rushing to judgement.

I'm liberal, very liberal, you could call me socialist and not be far from the truth. But I support the hiring of Bobby Hauck. I want the Griz to return to the football team seen in the Chase Reynolds video. So according to a lot of you posting on these related threads it is just time to come out, chime in with the Davies petition and the faculty letter and the Missoulian and Kaimen articles and call out for recinding the contract.

Or maybe, just maybe Griz football has nothing to do with political persuasion and you should just let that crap go. As GGNez encourages, choose wisely my friends or you may alienate even more fans with your ill thought out labeling of those currently within the fan base.

This.


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[signedbewildered]

Why is there no link to hookedon's petition in the comment section following this editorial?

 

[The.Real.2506]

Just set the same standard. If a student (non-athlete) gets in trouble the school should hold that professor(s) partially responsible. They should have their pay tied to enrollment in their classes and overall student conduct. How fast are these professors going to argue that they can’t control what kids do outside of their class?

Grades, what about grades.

Fortunately, I got out of teaching (evening classes/mostly graduate) before "grade inflation" started to creep into the sciences. Now, grades mean nothing as to the knowledge and competence of the student. In fact, I was totally shocked to see (in an older US News &WP article) that "more than 40 percent of all grades awarded were in the A range" among a survey sample of 200 colleges and universities. https://www.usnews.com/opinion/blog...inflation-is-a-real-problem-and-how-to-fix-it

That is total bulls**t! With that, any yoo-yoo should be able to end up with a GPA over 3.5 -- even if they never crack a book. My friends who are still in the supervisory workforce tell me, flat-out, that they pay no attention to the GPA any more. One lady said she interviewed an applicant who had a straight-A record. But a half-dozen easy questions indicated that this graduate (won't mention the school) had significant skill/knowledge gaps in the field where he had supposedly earned a B.S. degree.

So any criteria based on grades attained is probably totally worthless -- too many "A's" handed out as participation ribbons.

Edit: Yes, for undergraduate classes I did "grade on the curve."

Grade inflation is so bad now. From a different perspective, I don't inflate grades and I don't curve. The amount of supposed "A" students whining to me that they cannot believe they are getting a C in my courses is outstanding. My usual reply is welcome to a real college course.

Just imagine how much they would whine if the had classes from a real university :thumb:

 

[cmtgrizzly]

For any of those on the board that are currently professors at the U of M, have you ever been given a student to faculty ratio from the university to "break even" with your salary? Or your dept? In other words how many students have to be chemistry majors to pay for the chemistry faculty? I am sure there are many factors involved in keeping a dept solvent (research grants etc) but alot of those are probably more controlled variables and I am sure an analysis could be done for each professor and/or dept to see how many students need to be dedicated to a dept in order for it to pay for itself. I am not picking on chemsitry as I graduated from that dept and hope it is in no jeopardy. I think there are going to be some hard decisions that need to be made based on objective measures that will attract students and make U of M viable for the future and like it or not there are more professors and dept that are going to and should see cuts. New degrees that are more competitive in todays market will need to be added. We can only afford so many professors and fields of study. The one thing that could save some of these professors/dept is a drastic uptick in enrollment. They can fight it all they want, but at least anecdotally, a successful football team has been shown to increase enrollment. In the end Bobby Hauck may be able to save professors jobs and some students' field of study at the U of M despite the fact they could be actively striving to end his.

 

[Huge]

I know 3 of the individuals on this list. I assure you they are about as liberal as they come. I know that 2 of them are vocally against athletics, and feel that everything wrong at the university stems from the "devaluing of a liberal arts education" (Their words....)

Well, by charging $75,000 to learn something that pays $35,000 the liberal arts education is devaluing itself.

I have a liberal arts degree. And I can assure you I make a figure far in excess of $35,000. Liberal arts includes far more than interpretive dance, people.

Yes, and something I learned in my liberal arts education is that it is possible to listen, disagree and even strongly express our opinions without resorting to disrespect and insults.

 

[tnt]

I see 28 faculty signed. The U needs to eliminate 30 positions seems like an easy choice to me.

 

[jtgriz2]

After some hours of consideration, I have come to the conclusion that the university of Montana should not rescind Huacks’s job offer and contract. Carry on Bobby in your efforts to rebuild our football program and continue to make a positive impact on young men’s lives

 

[Huge]

I see 28 faculty signed. The U needs to eliminate 30 positions seems like an easy choice to me.

Well, obviously any liberal arts university worth it salt is going to weed out all the professors with divergent opinions. That’s just common sense... :roll:

 

[Mtgrizpolson]

After some hours of consideration, I have come to the conclusion that the university of Montana should not rescind Huacks’s job offer and contract. Carry on Bobby in your efforts to rebuild our football program and continue to make a positive impact on young men’s lives

:thumb:

 

[ManhattanGriz]

I have always followed egriz and just decided to finally post. I wonder if he faculty has ever thought that they also were a part of the players lives who had misconduct. They saw them on a regular basis just like Coach did. Makes me wonder did they ever do anything to help with the player misconduct? They too have a say in shaping the culture of the school because after all these athletes are students as well. Perhaps they should ditch the petitions and admit wrongdoings just like coach did and be part of the solution. Stop pointing fingers and be willing to be part of a team who helps mold these young athletes into fine young citizens.

 

[grizpsych]

For any of those on the board that are currently professors at the U of M, have you ever been given a student to faculty ratio from the university to "break even" with your salary? Or your dept? In other words how many students have to be chemistry majors to pay for the chemistry faculty? I am sure there are many factors involved in keeping a dept solvent (research grants etc) but alot of those are probably more controlled variables and I am sure an analysis could be done for each professor and/or dept to see how many students need to be dedicated to a dept in order for it to pay for itself. I am not picking on chemsitry as I graduated from that dept and hope it is in no jeopardy. I think there are going to be some hard decisions that need to be made based on objective measures that will attract students and make U of M viable for the future and like it or not there are more professors and dept that are going to and should see cuts. New degrees that are more competitive in todays market will need to be added. We can only afford so many professors and fields of study. The one thing that could save some of these professors/dept is a drastic uptick in enrollment. They can fight it all they want, but at least anecdotally, a successful football team has been shown to increase enrollment. In the end Bobby Hauck may be able to save professors jobs and some students' field of study at the U of M despite the fact they could be actively striving to end his.

Although I'm not at UM, SEMO's tuition and student body are similar enough for an estimate. We have to have 15 students in a course section for the class to be offered during a traditional semester and 12 to be paid in full during winter/summer sessions.

 

[mtgriz]

How many faculty positions would have to be cut to pay the ~$600,000 payout on Bobby Hauck’s already executed contract?

 

[cmtgrizzly]

For any of those on the board that are currently professors at the U of M, have you ever been given a student to faculty ratio from the university to "break even" with your salary? Or your dept? In other words how many students have to be chemistry majors to pay for the chemistry faculty? I am sure there are many factors involved in keeping a dept solvent (research grants etc) but alot of those are probably more controlled variables and I am sure an analysis could be done for each professor and/or dept to see how many students need to be dedicated to a dept in order for it to pay for itself. I am not picking on chemsitry as I graduated from that dept and hope it is in no jeopardy. I think there are going to be some hard decisions that need to be made based on objective measures that will attract students and make U of M viable for the future and like it or not there are more professors and dept that are going to and should see cuts. New degrees that are more competitive in todays market will need to be added. We can only afford so many professors and fields of study. The one thing that could save some of these professors/dept is a drastic uptick in enrollment. They can fight it all they want, but at least anecdotally, a successful football team has been shown to increase enrollment. In the end Bobby Hauck may be able to save professors jobs and some students' field of study at the U of M despite the fact they could be actively striving to end his.

Although I'm not at UM, SEMO's tuition and student body are similar enough for an estimate. We have to have 15 students in a course section for the class to be offered during a traditional semester and 12 to be paid in full during winter/summer sessions.

Great info! So not too many for a course to be covered. For those professors who dont have much research $ coming in I would guess they have to teach quite a few courses or have really large classes to cover their salary. Thanks!

 

[get'em_griz]

How many faculty positions would have to be cut to pay the ~$600,000 payout on Bobby Hauck’s already executed contract?

Excellent point!

 

[GottaluvGriz]

How many faculty positions would have to be cut to pay the ~$600,000 payout on Bobby Hauck’s already executed contract?

Doubtful any of the petitioners are Business professors so someone else would have to do the math for them. Maybe someone from the law school could explain to the petitioners what a contract is and how it works.
Welcome back Bobby!
Go Griz!