Missoula Rises is giving Griz Nation a chance to submit some questions

[Ringneck]

I understand, Ringneck. And, similar to your point, one could parse through all of these threads and "prove" that Grizzly Football fans are clueless and apathetic about sexual abuse/assault, that they think women are inferior and belong in the kitchen and that if they speak to women at work, they are likely to lose their homes in a lawsuit.

The extremes on both sides have become the vocal majority. It's Davey vs Goliath. (Just kidding, I thought that was punny)

But, Alpha v Davey is the epitome of what is wrong with the community on this issue. You see "them" as you described above, many of "them" see "us" as Alpha and others like him. Most on either side would not elect either of them as a representative.

Right, so why are we paying attention to any of them at all? Giving them attention gives credence to their agenda, either directly or by implication. And I think you and I agree - and probably many others, too - that giving them attention is counterproductive to the real work that needs to be done. It's a distraction, an amusing diversion from focusing on what really matters. Davey and her supporters won't be placated by an event like this. It will empower them to press forward and demand more attention and compliance to their agenda.

 

[SoldierGriz]

I understand, Ringneck. And, similar to your point, one could parse through all of these threads and "prove" that Grizzly Football fans are clueless and apathetic about sexual abuse/assault, that they think women are inferior and belong in the kitchen and that if they speak to women at work, they are likely to lose their homes in a lawsuit.

The extremes on both sides have become the vocal majority. It's Davey vs Goliath. (Just kidding, I thought that was punny)

But, Alpha v Davey is the epitome of what is wrong with the community on this issue. You see "them" as you described above, many of "them" see "us" as Alpha and others like him. Most on either side would not elect either of them as a representative.

Right, so why are we paying attention to any of them at all? Giving them attention gives credence to their agenda, either directly or by implication. And I think you and I agree - and probably many others, too - that giving them attention is counterproductive to the real work that needs to be done. It's a distraction, an amusing diversion from focusing on what really matters. Davey and her supporters won't be placated by an event like this. It will empower them to press forward and demand more attention and compliance to their agenda.

+1

 

[GGNez]

I understand, Ringneck. And, similar to your point, one could parse through all of these threads and "prove" that Grizzly Football fans are clueless and apathetic about sexual abuse/assault, that they think women are inferior and belong in the kitchen and that if they speak to women at work, they are likely to lose their homes in a lawsuit.

The extremes on both sides have become the vocal majority. It's Davey vs Goliath. (Just kidding, I thought that was punny)

But, Alpha v Davey is the epitome of what is wrong with the community on this issue. You see "them" as you described above, many of "them" see "us" as Alpha and others like him. Most on either side would not elect either of them as a representative.

Right, so why are we paying attention to any of them at all? Giving them attention gives credence to their agenda, either directly or by implication. And I think you and I agree - and probably many others, too - that giving them attention is counterproductive to the real work that needs to be done. It's a distraction, an amusing diversion from focusing on what really matters. Davey and her supporters won't be placated by an event like this. It will empower them to press forward and demand more attention and compliance to their agenda.

In my assessment, we are paying attention because most of "them" wouldn't have gone so far as to slander Hauck and put out falsehoods about him. Just as most of "us" are pretty pissed to see AG's words used as an example of how the community of Football fans views things. The attitude and spirit of cooperation and a community of "us" (meaning the left and right; football fans and non fans) VS inequality and assault is worth working toward.

I get what you are saying. Just as there are many men on here who saw my lengthy novel/post and rolled their eyes, made a jerking-off hand gesture and scrolled on past, there are people on the OTHER side who are surely appalled about my "Cold Beaver" jokes. I probably lost a job reference or two when I joked that there were pictures with Cold Smoke "on" me all over the internet.

My dream: one day we all drop the pitchforks, agree to respectfully disagree on some things and enjoy the best in one another. (Cue the music: kumbaya my looorrddd....♪♫♪)

 

[Ringneck]

I understand, Ringneck. And, similar to your point, one could parse through all of these threads and "prove" that Grizzly Football fans are clueless and apathetic about sexual abuse/assault, that they think women are inferior and belong in the kitchen and that if they speak to women at work, they are likely to lose their homes in a lawsuit.

The extremes on both sides have become the vocal majority. It's Davey vs Goliath. (Just kidding, I thought that was punny)

But, Alpha v Davey is the epitome of what is wrong with the community on this issue. You see "them" as you described above, many of "them" see "us" as Alpha and others like him. Most on either side would not elect either of them as a representative.

Right, so why are we paying attention to any of them at all? Giving them attention gives credence to their agenda, either directly or by implication. And I think you and I agree - and probably many others, too - that giving them attention is counterproductive to the real work that needs to be done. It's a distraction, an amusing diversion from focusing on what really matters. Davey and her supporters won't be placated by an event like this. It will empower them to press forward and demand more attention and compliance to their agenda.

In my assessment, we are paying attention because most of "them" wouldn't have gone so far as to slander Hauck and put out falsehoods about him. Just as most of "us" are pretty pissed to see AG's words used as an example of how the community of Football fans views things. The attitude and spirit of cooperation and a community of "us" (meaning the left and right; football fans and non fans) VS inequality and assault is worth working toward.

I get what you are saying. Just as there are many men on here who saw my lengthy novel/post and rolled their eyes, made a jerking-off hand gesture and scrolled on past, there are people on the OTHER side who are surely appalled about my "Cold Beaver" jokes. I probably lost a job reference or two when I joked that there were pictures with Cold Smoke "on" me all over the internet.

My dream: one day we all drop the pitchforks, agree to respectfully disagree on some things and enjoy the best in one another. (Cue the music: kumbaya my looorrddd....♪♫♪)

Agreed, again. So perhaps we should be working towards that on neutral, agreed-upon terms (whatever those might be), rather than on the terms dictated to us by those we disagree with. Make no mistake - they are not looking for an open-minded discussion and resolution. They are looking for attention and validation. Ignoring them gives them neither. Don't oil the squeaky wheels.

 

[GGNez]

Agreed, again. So perhaps we should be working towards that on neutral, agreed-upon terms (whatever those might be), rather than on the terms dictated to us by those we disagree with. Make no mistake - they are not looking for an open-minded discussion and resolution. They are looking for attention and validation. Ignoring them gives them neither. Don't oil the squeaky wheels.

That would be nice, no doubt. I will certainly be front and center to see how the forum plays out. But at this point, were the UM reps to refuse a discussion, it would fuel the fire and give the appearance of rejecting an olive branch (regardless of who should or shouldn't be extending one).

Another thought: perhaps...bear with me....perhaps some of the anti-Hauck folks got all worked up before doing any research. They rallied against a false enemy. NOW, if they have this forum and everyone is nice and respectful, they can change their tune and give BH a "second chance" without admitting they were hasty in their protests.

 

[Ringneck]

Agreed, again. So perhaps we should be working towards that on neutral, agreed-upon terms (whatever those might be), rather than on the terms dictated to us by those we disagree with. Make no mistake - they are not looking for an open-minded discussion and resolution. They are looking for attention and validation. Ignoring them gives them neither. Don't oil the squeaky wheels.

That would be nice, no doubt. I will certainly be front and center to see how the forum plays out. But at this point, (1) were the UM reps to refuse a discussion, it would fuel the fire and give the appearance of rejecting an olive branch (regardless of who should or shouldn't be extending one).

Another thought: perhaps...bear with me....perhaps some of the anti-Hauck folks got all worked up before doing any research. (2) They rallied against a false enemy. NOW, if they have this forum and everyone is nice and respectful, they can change their tune and give BH a "second chance" without admitting they were hasty in their protests.

1) I'd propose that this is exactly what the Davey crowd wanted: a damned-if-we-do / damned-if-we-don't scenario. U of M can accept the invitation and get schooled and humiliated, or reject the invitation and imply its culpability in the problem.

2) Absolutely. And I would suggest that the enemy they should be looking for is radical feminism, which has sought to systematically disrupt and destroy most of the traditional familial and cultural structures that have been integral in teaching boys how to become responsible, caring, courageous men.

 

[Spanky]

Agreed, again. So perhaps we should be working towards that on neutral, agreed-upon terms (whatever those might be), rather than on the terms dictated to us by those we disagree with. Make no mistake - they are not looking for an open-minded discussion and resolution. They are looking for attention and validation. Ignoring them gives them neither. Don't oil the squeaky wheels.

That would be nice, no doubt. I will certainly be front and center to see how the forum plays out. But at this point, (1) were the UM reps to refuse a discussion, it would fuel the fire and give the appearance of rejecting an olive branch (regardless of who should or shouldn't be extending one).

Another thought: perhaps...bear with me....perhaps some of the anti-Hauck folks got all worked up before doing any research. (2) They rallied against a false enemy. NOW, if they have this forum and everyone is nice and respectful, they can change their tune and give BH a "second chance" without admitting they were hasty in their protests.

1) I'd propose that this is exactly what the Davey crowd wanted: a damned-if-we-do / damned-if-we-don't scenario. U of M can accept the invitation and get schooled and humiliated, or reject the invitation and imply its culpability in the problem.

2) Absolutely. And I would suggest that the enemy they should be looking for is radical feminism, which has sought to systematically disrupt and destroy most of the traditional familial and cultural structures that have been integral in teaching boys how to become responsible, caring, courageous men.

Bingo!!

 

[GGNez]

1) I'd propose that this is exactly what the Davey crowd wanted: a damned-if-we-do / damned-if-we-don't scenario. U of M can accept the invitation and get schooled and humiliated, or reject the invitation and imply its culpability in the problem.

2) Absolutely. And I would suggest that the enemy they should be looking for is radical feminism, which has sought to systematically disrupt and destroy most of the traditional familial and cultural structures that have been integral in teaching boys how to become responsible, caring, courageous men.

Agree to disagree on motives and "enemy". I don't actually believe that there was as malicious intent as many believe in regard to the purpose of this forum. Some could look at the conversations here and rightfully conclude (based on comments by several), that the purpose is for Hauck, Haslam and Bodnar to attack Lisa Davey and her petition. I guarantee they have no intention of doing that. Some of the content will be discussed, I'm sure. But, I don't think either side is on the attack.

Radical feminism is a problem just as "radical" anything is, and is definitely the enemy on one side of this. Misogyny, sexism and turning a blind eye to it is the enemy on the other. Neither of them are anything but toxic.

Meanwhile, I'm just trying to figure out how much Cold Smoke to buy and where to bring it.

 

[Spanky]

Spanky didn’t write it though

 

[Spanky]

But I agree with Ringmeck

 

[GGNez]

But I agree with Ringmeck

Ha. Screwed up my quoting...

Sorry ‘bout that, Spanky!! Xo

 

[Spanky]

But I agree with Ringmeck

Ha. Screwed up my quoting...

Sorry ‘bout that, Spanky!! Xo

I thought I screwed it up.

 

[GGNez]

But I agree with Ringmeck

Ha. Screwed up my quoting...

Sorry ‘bout that, Spanky!! Xo

I thought I screwed it up.

Spanks, I think you and I both know that you can do no wrong. :heart:

 

[mondayamqb]

Way, way back when this whole mess started, the community--UM administration, UM police, health service, city police, county attorney--voluntarily (and some involuntarily) made many changes in personnel, procedure, training, and support. Since then, the DOJ has complimented our officials. Other Universities have used UM's tutorial as a model. There haven't been any victim reports of lack of respect or support. Many would claim we are in the forefront of universities nationwide in providing a safe campus environment for students. I believe the previous administrations greatest fault was in not letting parents of prospective students know of these reforms...letting the rape culture perception persist, perpetuated by Krackwhore's book. Don't repeat this mistake by rehashing old news. The past is history. Move on. The questions should be positive and focused on where we are today and going forward. Do they feel that the community changes referenced above have resulted in Missoula and UM being a safer and more welcoming place today.

 

[putter]

If you read my previous post I believe Ms. Davey had very malicious intent by using the methods she did to try and make sure Hauck was not hired. My concern is this....Despite her methods she gets a seat at the table with the University President, AD and Football Coach in this forum, very slippery slope. I don't believe they will attack her, I believe they want to address the issue and pacify her to move on.

 

[GGNez]

If the discussion next Monday is even 10% as interesting and productive as the recent dialogue with everyone here, it can only be positive. I've truly enjoyed exchanging thoughts, ideas and opinions here and appreciate your tolerance of my "wordiness" and undiagnosed yet probable ODD (thanks for the insight, CatGrad). What a smart, thoughtful, witty, diverse and intersting group of people! Can't wait till football season when we have really good stuff to discuss!

 

[fanofzoo]

Agreed, again. So perhaps we should be working towards that on neutral, agreed-upon terms (whatever those might be), rather than on the terms dictated to us by those we disagree with. Make no mistake - they are not looking for an open-minded discussion and resolution. They are looking for attention and validation. Ignoring them gives them neither. Don't oil the squeaky wheels.

That would be nice, no doubt. I will certainly be front and center to see how the forum plays out. But at this point, were the UM reps to refuse a discussion, it would fuel the fire and give the appearance of rejecting an olive branch (regardless of who should or shouldn't be extending one).

Another thought: perhaps...bear with me....perhaps some of the anti-Hauck folks got all worked up before doing any research. They rallied against a false enemy. NOW, if they have this forum and everyone is nice and respectful, they can change their tune and give BH a "second chance" without admitting they were hasty in their protests.

What color is the sun in your world ?

 

[GGNez]

Agreed, again. So perhaps we should be working towards that on neutral, agreed-upon terms (whatever those might be), rather than on the terms dictated to us by those we disagree with. Make no mistake - they are not looking for an open-minded discussion and resolution. They are looking for attention and validation. Ignoring them gives them neither. Don't oil the squeaky wheels.

That would be nice, no doubt. I will certainly be front and center to see how the forum plays out. But at this point, were the UM reps to refuse a discussion, it would fuel the fire and give the appearance of rejecting an olive branch (regardless of who should or shouldn't be extending one).

Another thought: perhaps...bear with me....perhaps some of the anti-Hauck folks got all worked up before doing any research. They rallied against a false enemy. NOW, if they have this forum and everyone is nice and respectful, they can change their tune and give BH a "second chance" without admitting they were hasty in their protests.

What color is the sun in your world ?

Based on a multitude of PMs I receive daily, I'd say it's pretty much true to life for the most part.

 

[AZGrizFan]

I understand, Ringneck. And, similar to your point, one could parse through all of these threads and "prove" that Grizzly Football fans are clueless and apathetic about sexual abuse/assault, that they think women are inferior and belong in the kitchen and that if they speak to women at work, they are likely to lose their homes in a lawsuit.

The extremes on both sides have become the vocal majority. It's Davey vs Goliath. (Just kidding, I thought that was punny)

But, Alpha v Davey is the epitome of what is wrong with the community on this issue. You see "them" as you described above, many of "them" see "us" as Alpha and others like him. Most on either side would not elect either of them as a representative.

Yet only one of them is at the Forum. Mmmm hmmm....

 

[GGNez]

I understand, Ringneck. And, similar to your point, one could parse through all of these threads and "prove" that Grizzly Football fans are clueless and apathetic about sexual abuse/assault, that they think women are inferior and belong in the kitchen and that if they speak to women at work, they are likely to lose their homes in a lawsuit.

The extremes on both sides have become the vocal majority. It's Davey vs Goliath. (Just kidding, I thought that was punny)

But, Alpha v Davey is the epitome of what is wrong with the community on this issue. You see "them" as you described above, many of "them" see "us" as Alpha and others like him. Most on either side would not elect either of them as a representative.

Yet only one of them is at the Forum. Mmmm hmmm....

Really, AZ? You want him on the m-f'ing forum? Jesus. Get real.