Its Time to Clean House.

[grizatwork]

I quit reading when the thread went off the rails, but I would like to remark on tnt's original post. I have been going to games since 1986. I have been to homecoming game's in Read's, Dennehy's, Glenn's, Hauck's, Pflugrad, and Delany's time here. I can say with certainty that I have been to game's with the stadium less full to begin with and less full after halftime.

It was a blow out early. It started sprinkling at half-time. Northern Colorado showed nothing that indicated they were going to do anything different in the second half. The coaching staff obviously was trying to shorten the game, work on the run and rest starters. It was the same thing I have seen every other staff do. Come on guys.

 

[PlayerRep]

I got it I got I finally got it, AND you even insulted your kids along the way............

Jokes on you. You obviously don't know that financial contributions have nothing to do with being accepted at any of the schools I attended.

Maybe I don't understand but..

My contributions to both of my alma maters have been sufficient for some of my kids to be accepted at both schools,

You don't get the "joke" when it's laid out in front of you.

 

[dupuyer griz]

I got it I got I finally got it, AND you even insulted your kids along the way............

Jokes on you. You obviously don't know that financial contributions have nothing to do with being accepted at any of the schools I attended.

Maybe I don't understand but..

My contributions to both of my alma maters have been sufficient for some of my kids to be accepted at both schools,

You don't get the "joke" when it's laid out in front of you.

Funny thing about jokes...they're funny...

 

[grizcountry420]

 

[IroneagleXP]

I liked the game. Had a great day. Talked to lots of people--all having fun. Didn't like seeing John Nguyen go down.

I would like to see the house cleaned of bad fans like TNT. Spoiled. Don't understand the game. Don't understand or appreciate sport. Bad for the program.

Not impressed with the BSC as a whole conference right now But why when any one has an opinion on a game that isn't the same as yours, they don't understand the game? He is a Bad Fan for giving his perception on how his entertainment dollars were spent. When you sell anything, it is not considered a good deal unless the perceived value exceeds the cost, simple. How is what he said bad for the program? Why is your perception of what is good or bad better than his perception?

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not they own set of facts, and you should realize you are not the only one with the facts.

Nope. I save the never-played-the-game label for special people who I view as jerks and truly not understanding the game or sport. Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but that doesn't mean their opinion is correct, and that doesn't mean that everyone else who disagrees with their opinion is not allowed to disagree with it or criticize it. I find it odd that some people apparently think that being entitled to their opinion means that no one can disagree with or criticize that opinion. Why am I not entitled to to my opinion that some people don't know what they're talking about and are unsupportive and bad fans?

PlayerRep. ....It's not that people are saying you aren't entitled to your opinion. What people have a problem with is the manner in which you express it. You can disagree with someone without being a pompous condescending asshole. You don't know everything about the game of football. Futhermore, TNT and Rob are not bad fans for making an observation and commenting on it, nor does it make them unsupportive of the team. If anybody would qualify for getting a 'bad" fan award it would be YOU for being such a jerk off.

 

[PlayerRep]

I liked the game. Had a great day. Talked to lots of people--all having fun. Didn't like seeing John Nguyen go down.

I would like to see the house cleaned of bad fans like TNT. Spoiled. Don't understand the game. Don't understand or appreciate sport. Bad for the program.

Not impressed with the BSC as a whole conference right now But why when any one has an opinion on a game that isn't the same as yours, they don't understand the game? He is a Bad Fan for giving his perception on how his entertainment dollars were spent. When you sell anything, it is not considered a good deal unless the perceived value exceeds the cost, simple. How is what he said bad for the program? Why is your perception of what is good or bad better than his perception?

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not they own set of facts, and you should realize you are not the only one with the facts.

Nope. I save the never-played-the-game label for special people who I view as jerks and truly not understanding the game or sport. Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but that doesn't mean their opinion is correct, and that doesn't mean that everyone else who disagrees with their opinion is not allowed to disagree with it or criticize it. I find it odd that some people apparently think that being entitled to their opinion means that no one can disagree with or criticize that opinion. Why am I not entitled to to my opinion that some people don't know what they're talking about and are unsupportive and bad fans?

PlayerRep. ....It's not that people are saying you aren't entitled to your opinion. What people have a problem with is the manner in which you express it. You can disagree with someone without being a pompous condescending asshole. You don't know everything about the game of football. Futhermore, TNT and Rob are not bad fans for making an observation and commenting on it, nor does it make them unsupportive of the team. If anybody would qualify for getting a 'bad" fan award it would be YOU for being such a jerk off.

Sorry, I'm usually very confident and direct in what I say. I don't have time to baby posters, especially whom I have no respect for or think are jerks. I'm entitled to my opinion, and I will continue to express my views. You've proven that you don't know what you're talking about and are pretty much a troll. I'm certainly not going to listen to you. And I know you make posts like this because I've stung you a few times.

 

[grizcountry420]

I know you make posts like this because I've stung you a few times.

No shit! Yeah you did!!

 

[mtgrizrule]

mtgrizrule: again, you are spot on! I had the thought at half-time that MD was going to try to get the kinks worked out on the running game. That kind of running game is just too predictable. Run on first and second downs, pass on third and long, and punt. Hopefully the co-offensive coordinators can now prove to MD that his very conservative offensive mind needs opened.

Thanks granite. According to a few others, myself nor anyone can be objective and give constructive criticism. Don't you know, that is being a bad fan? I asked before, and will ask again, "How much better is an offense mixing things up and utilizing the whole field, including the middle 2/3's of the field consistently? I felt the 1st half was the best mixture of play calling since Delaney has been coach Did that kind of offensive play calling even make some of you see the importance of mixing things up, like they did? Is that kind of play calling much more effective than the old WR screens, or going deep the majority of time?

That 1st half offense was exactly the example of what I was referring earlier in the week on how to make this offense better. Feel free to read my posts prior to this game on things I thought needed to improve for this offense. Then watch the game again, or replay it in your mind. What was the offensive play calling doing in the 1st half consistently that we very seldom did before? Then, tell me what offensive play calling is more efficient, fun, and reliable?

I pray and hope, for the sake of this team, we see these things implemented more often. Imagine how much more effective that kind of play calling would be with our best WR, Henderson healthy. They did that offense without his presence. :thumb:

I'm going to continue beating the importance of utilizing the whole field consistently and changing things up, until the offensive play calling is doing this consistently.

 

[AZGrizFan]

I watched the root replay tonight and also looked over the play by play stats at gogriz.com. The first drive of the second half was a 4 minute, 60 yard drive that resulted in the successful mid range FG (one of the things the team has struggled with and hence got to "work on" in the second half).

UNC then held the ball for its own 9 minute drive which resulted in a matching FG. With a 38-10 lead, although I didn't play the game I'd say a bend don't break defensive scheme here is not subject to criticism. Needing a lot of points, UNC consumed 30% of the second half clock to get 3 points.

Next griz drive was two quick first downs covering 23 yards into UNC territory, ended by
Canada's fumble (which would have been reversed on replay if the BSC used it- his knee was down before the ball came out). It would have been 2nd down and 6 yards to go from the UNC 44 yard line.

The final three possessions were run-out-the-clock possessions with reserves that, given the injury situation I am also okay with the strategy used there. Oh, and one of these possessions had a 3rd and 10 conversion with a beautiful pass from JJ10 to JJ6.

Not every game will be an instant classic like the SDSU or App State playoff games, but that doesn't mean it wasn't a well played and coached game.

Great post. :thumb:

 

[ordigger]

All I ended up getting out of this thread is that Monte is probably Growler.

 

[AZGrizFan]

This team (and this coaching staff) aren't that far from being really good.

We can bitch about the offense all we want, but as the O-line matures (and they are getting better each game), they'll start executing better, working better together, and have nowhere to go but up. I'm excited to see what this O-line will look like by the last 3 games of the year. My concerns are about the lack of EH so far, and the loss of a couple other playmakers which could have an impact on the development of the offense as a whole.

Defensively, bitch about the stats all you want. The yardage numbers allowed, the first downs allowed, time of possession, etc. don't mean shit, in all honesty. There's only three stats in my mind that have any significance: Turnover differential, PPG differential, and Red Zone Defense. Turnovers are 9-3 in favor of the Griz. Enough said. Griz have a PPG differential of over 10, and their red zone defense is off the charts: just 8 touchdowns allowed overall, only 73% red zone conversion allowed, and just 27% (4 of 15) TOUCHDOWNS allowed in the red zone. Let that sink in for a minute. Just FOUR of 15 TD's allowed inside the red zone.

 

[IroneagleXP]

I don't think Payton's point was "bad fan vs good fan" his point is NO ONE IS FORCED TO BE A GRIZ fan. I've posted the same thing many many times. When fans go over the line of what they're actually entitled to, I think it's worth reminding them that they are indeed NOT entitled to what they think they are.

I'm sorry, but NOWHERE on a season ticket does it say the Griz will won that game, will play a certain style, will hire a certain coach, will play more Montana-born kids over California or Washington-born kids, will go for it on 4th down, will have a kicker who can make 60 yard boots with regularity, will ever beat the Cats again, will have Monte jump in with the Skydivers, will play Alpha's favorite songs, and the list of what the UM DOES NOT PROMISE YOU OR OWE YOU due to the price of admission goes on and on. I know this because I am looking at a season ticket right now, and I don't see any of the things, or ANY promises for that matter.

I also did not have anyone show up at my doorstep and strong-arm me into purchasing this season ticket. It was a choice and the choice was mine and mine alone. I made that choice knowing full well I have ZERO say, input or control over matters that pertain to Grizzly football inside the white lines, at practice, in meeting rooms, in the AD's office and so on.

Point is, we CHOOSE TO BE FANS, we don't HAVE TO BE. We CHOOSE to spend out money on Griz football, WE DO NOT HAVE TO. And if WE as fans DON'T LIKE Grizzly football anymore, WE don;t have to be fans anymore. It's that simple. For me, the choice is actually really simple, I will CHOOSE to be a Griz fan until I'm dead in the ground. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, and I won't think there's anything wrong with Monte or TNT or AG1 or Growler for deciding NOT to be Griz fans anymore either.

geeezus. You can be critical about certain aspects of the team and still be a fan. If you have to be eternally optimistic and choose to be ignorant to areas of concern then you need to put down the koolaid. In fact, being a fan puts you in the position of knowing your team and being accurate with criticism wouldn't you say...

 

[IroneagleXP]

I don't think Payton's point was "bad fan vs good fan" his point is NO ONE IS FORCED TO BE A GRIZ fan. I've posted the same thing many many times. When fans go over the line of what they're actually entitled to, I think it's worth reminding them that they are indeed NOT entitled to what they think they are.

I'm sorry, but NOWHERE on a season ticket does it say the Griz will won that game, will play a certain style, will hire a certain coach, will play more Montana-born kids over California or Washington-born kids, will go for it on 4th down, will have a kicker who can make 60 yard boots with regularity, will ever beat the Cats again, will have Monte jump in with the Skydivers, will play Alpha's favorite songs, and the list of what the UM DOES NOT PROMISE YOU OR OWE YOU due to the price of admission goes on and on. I know this because I am looking at a season ticket right now, and I don't see any of the things, or ANY promises for that matter.

I also did not have anyone show up at my doorstep and strong-arm me into purchasing this season ticket. It was a choice and the choice was mine and mine alone. I made that choice knowing full well I have ZERO say, input or control over matters that pertain to Grizzly football inside the white lines, at practice, in meeting rooms, in the AD's office and so on.

Point is, we CHOOSE TO BE FANS, we don't HAVE TO BE. We CHOOSE to spend out money on Griz football, WE DO NOT HAVE TO. And if WE as fans DON'T LIKE Grizzly football anymore, WE don;t have to be fans anymore. It's that simple. For me, the choice is actually really simple, I will CHOOSE to be a Griz fan until I'm dead in the ground. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, and I won't think there's anything wrong with Monte or TNT or AG1 or Growler for deciding NOT to be Griz fans anymore either.

Thats exactly right. And when what is being delivered is a less desirable product and you start losing fans changes need to be made. Whether its a change in coaching, ADs office, or main hall, its irrelevent so long as the changes are made.

If you honestly believe that the haslam - delaney - engstrom combination is what will bring the program forward and has no part in large numbers of fans being very unhappy go for it. If you are so incredibly stupid to believe that people quit liking and following their team or continue to send in their checks when they are unhappy go for that to. I was fan through carlson, gritted my teeth through Hauck, and thrilled when Don Read, despite his defection to NAU was brought in to restore the integrity of the AD office.

Yeah there is no gurantee printed on the ticket, but that doesn't mean you don't have expectations or are less of a fan when you let folks know you are unhappy.

Constant complaining, combined with some of the lies you tell, hurts the program much more than what's you've been complaining about today.

You sir, have a "God Complex"

"A god complex is an unshakable belief characterized by consistently inflated feelings of personal ability, privilege, or infallibility. A person with a god complex may refuse to admit the possibility of their error or failure, even in the face of complex or intractable problems or difficult or impossible tasks, or may regard their personal opinions as unquestionably correct.[1][2] The individual may disregard the rules of society and require special consideration or privileges."

referenced from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_complex

LMAO :clap:

 

[IroneagleXP]

Not impressed with the BSC as a whole conference right now But why when any one has an opinion on a game that isn't the same as yours, they don't understand the game? He is a Bad Fan for giving his perception on how his entertainment dollars were spent. When you sell anything, it is not considered a good deal unless the perceived value exceeds the cost, simple. How is what he said bad for the program? Why is your perception of what is good or bad better than his perception?

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not they own set of facts, and you should realize you are not the only one with the facts.

Nope. I save the never-played-the-game label for special people who I view as jerks and truly not understanding the game or sport. Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but that doesn't mean their 2 is correct, and that doesn't mean that everyone else who disagrees with their opinion is not allowed to disagree with it or criticize it. I find it odd that some people apparently think that being entitled to their opinion means that no one can disagree with or criticize that opinion. Why am I not entitled to to my opinion that some people don't know what they're talking about and are unsupportive and bad fans?

PlayerRep. ....It's not that people are saying you aren't entitled to your opinion. What people have a problem with is the manner in which you express it. You can disagree with someone without being a pompous condescending asshole. You don't know everything about the game of football. Futhermore, TNT and Rob are not bad fans for making an observation and commenting on it, nor does it make them unsupportive of the team. If anybody would qualify for getting a 'bad" fan award it would be YOU for being such a jerk off.

Sorry, I'm usually very confident and direct in what I say. I don't have time to baby posters, especially whom I have no respect for or think are jerks. I'm entitled to my opinion, and I will continue to express my views. You've proven that you don't know what you're talking about and are pretty much a troll. I'm certainly not going to listen to you. And I know you make posts like this because I've stung you a few times.

stung me a few times? Lol. I would have to give a shit about you and your opinion to let your typed words sting me... I have trolled, it's true. I generally dislike 90% of Griz fans because they come off as spoiled self entitled douchebags...which is why I troll. But for you PlayerRep I make a special effort. I truly dislike you. You are the embodiment of a pompous prick who needs his ass kicked in real life. ...And there is nothing wrong with confidence...but you're not confident, you are blatantly arrogant and not near as smart as you think you are. And havirgrizfan...stop trying to talk to Monte like he is wrong, you sound silly.

 

[Potomac Griz]

geeezus. You can be critical about certain aspects of the team and still be a fan. If you have to be eternally optimistic and choose to be ignorant to areas of concern then you need to put down the koolaid. In fact, being a fan puts you in the position of knowing your team and being accurate with criticism wouldn't you say...

WTF, I agree with IroneagleXP on this. Did someone slip some meth into my beer? :mrgreen:

You know, what's kind of funny is I look at the football forum compared to the basketball forum during the season and it's like night and day. On the football forum if you talk about the weaknesses of the team, how shit just isn't going well on offense, the play calling or some of the "WTF" moments Delaney has had over the years you're a bad fan...

On the basketball forum you have a much smaller group of very dedicated fans that have followed the BB program through some incredibly rough years in the past. Almost all of these fans are perfectly fine with discussing the strengths and weaknesses without it turning into cries of "bad fan" and "sell your tickets" or other crap like that. Sure internet slap fights break out occasionally, and Growler pops up to critique someone's shooting motion on occasion (seriously :lol: ) or claim someone doesn't have NBA talent (who is currently in the NBA), but it's nothing like the FB section.

Makes me wonder... if the much smaller group of Griz BB fans who are diehard fans are OK with discussing problems they see & even perceived coaching mistakes why is it so many FB fans aren't? Could it be some of the koolaid drinkers who view the coaching staff as infallible are more the "social gathering" type of fans and not really into the game itself that much?

I'm not talking about the overly positive yet knowledgeable people who are still capable of seeing issues & discussing them without covering their ears and screaming "bad fan bad fan bad fan." I'm talking about the crowd that seems to just stick their heads in the sand and mutter "NO PROBLEMS HERE, YOU ARE A BAD FAN, DELANEY = NC AND OUR SAVIOR AMEN" incessantly.

Could it be they just don't want to see that there could be a problem because it's not a fun thing to think about for a fan that's used to always being on top? Meanwhile the fans who have seen the highs and lows are willing to discuss it without telling others they are bad fans?

Curious what others think on this. And I'm prepared for the torrent of insults that is likely headed my way.

 

[mtgrizrule]

geeezus. You can be critical about certain aspects of the team and still be a fan. If you have to be eternally optimistic and choose to be ignorant to areas of concern then you need to put down the koolaid. In fact, being a fan puts you in the position of knowing your team and being accurate with criticism wouldn't you say...

WTF, I agree with IroneagleXP on this. Did someone slip some meth into my beer? :mrgreen:

You know, what's kind of funny is I look at the football forum compared to the basketball forum during the season and it's like night and day. On the football forum if you talk about the weaknesses of the team, how shit just isn't going well on offense, the play calling or some of the "WTF" moments Delaney has had over the years you're a bad fan...

On the basketball forum you have a much smaller group of very dedicated fans that have followed the BB program through some incredibly rough years in the past. Almost all of these fans are perfectly fine with discussing the strengths and weaknesses without it turning into cries of "bad fan" and "sell your tickets" or other crap like that. Sure internet slap fights break out occasionally, and Growler pops up to critique someone's shooting motion on occasion (seriously :lol: ) or claim someone doesn't have NBA talent (who is currently in the NBA), but it's nothing like the FB section.

Makes me wonder... if the much smaller group of Griz BB fans who are diehard fans are OK with discussing problems they see & even perceived coaching mistakes why is it so many FB fans aren't? Could it be some of the koolaid drinkers who view the coaching staff as infallible are more the "social gathering" type of fans and not really into the game itself that much?

I'm not talking about the overly positive yet knowledgeable people who are still capable of seeing issues & discussing them without covering their ears and screaming "bad fan bad fan bad fan." I'm talking about the crowd that seems to just stick their heads in the sand and mutter "NO PROBLEMS HERE, YOU ARE A BAD FAN, DELANEY = NC AND OUR SAVIOR AMEN" incessantly.

Could it be they just don't want to see that there could be a problem because it's not a fun thing to think about for a fan that's used to always being on top? Meanwhile the fans who have seen the highs and lows are willing to discuss it without telling others they are bad fans?

Curious what others think on this. And I'm prepared for the torrent of insults that is likely headed my way.

Terrific post, on the money, and so true. :thumb:

 

[George Ferguson]

Some posters have such a chip on their shoulder when it comes to posting about this coaching staff and what they want to say about Delaney that they can't or refuse to read what others write. In NOT one of my posts did I can anyone a bad fan. In not ONE of my posts did I say TNT or Monte weren't entitled to their opinion. What I did say though was:

"See that's what I have a problem with, not TNT's opinion that the house needs to be cleaned."

"I have no problem with you guys stating your opinions on firing a coach mid-season, the morning after a victory, but attendance just isn't a valid one."

"I won't think there's anything wrong with Monte or TNT or AG1 or Growler for deciding NOT to be Griz fans anymore either."


"I accept that you are exercising your right to be unhappy with the Griz football program, and possibly walking away from the Griz all together. I accept that and have no interest in trying to stop you."

I would call those four statements pretty civil and not at all critical. But if Monte or TNT cares to go back and re-read my posts in this thread, they'll see I've never called anyone a bad fan, and also never told them they weren't entitled to their opinions on Griz football, or that they should shut up. Nope, never said or implied any of those things. Like I said, there are just a handful of posters that want and need so badly to be right about what they're saying about the coaching staff, and Griz football as a while, that they won't even read anything else, but will still fire back with responses to the posters they know don't agree with them (me, Player, AZ)and yet it's clear they didn't even fully read any of those posts. I on other hand, read every single word Monte, TNT and MTgrizrule have had to say in this thread, and would never of responded if I hadn't.

 

[Mr. Greenjeans]

Piss off troll, that a douche copter as yourself is shillling for that hideous example of a football field says it all.

The EWOO tampon field is an insult to college football, OTOH if you are a glorified junior college any PR is good.

 

[PlayerRep]

geeezus. You can be critical about certain aspects of the team and still be a fan. If you have to be eternally optimistic and choose to be ignorant to areas of concern then you need to put down the koolaid. In fact, being a fan puts you in the position of knowing your team and being accurate with criticism wouldn't you say...

WTF, I agree with IroneagleXP on this. Did someone slip some meth into my beer? :mrgreen:

You know, what's kind of funny is I look at the football forum compared to the basketball forum during the season and it's like night and day. On the football forum if you talk about the weaknesses of the team, how shit just isn't going well on offense, the play calling or some of the "WTF" moments Delaney has had over the years you're a bad fan...

On the basketball forum you have a much smaller group of very dedicated fans that have followed the BB program through some incredibly rough years in the past. Almost all of these fans are perfectly fine with discussing the strengths and weaknesses without it turning into cries of "bad fan" and "sell your tickets" or other crap like that. Sure internet slap fights break out occasionally, and Growler pops up to critique someone's shooting motion on occasion (seriously :lol: ) or claim someone doesn't have NBA talent (who is currently in the NBA), but it's nothing like the FB section.

Makes me wonder... if the much smaller group of Griz BB fans who are diehard fans are OK with discussing problems they see & even perceived coaching mistakes why is it so many FB fans aren't? Could it be some of the koolaid drinkers who view the coaching staff as infallible are more the "social gathering" type of fans and not really into the game itself that much?

I'm not talking about the overly positive yet knowledgeable people who are still capable of seeing issues & discussing them without covering their ears and screaming "bad fan bad fan bad fan." I'm talking about the crowd that seems to just stick their heads in the sand and mutter "NO PROBLEMS HERE, YOU ARE A BAD FAN, DELANEY = NC AND OUR SAVIOR AMEN" incessantly.

Could it be they just don't want to see that there could be a problem because it's not a fun thing to think about for a fan that's used to always being on top? Meanwhile the fans who have seen the highs and lows are willing to discuss it without telling others they are bad fans?

Curious what others think on this. And I'm prepared for the torrent of insults that is likely headed my way.

1. You admit to agreeing with an admitted troll, a Bobcat posing as an EWU fan. That's pretty funny. Shows your true colors.

2. Not one poster has said that other posters are not entitled to their opinions, yet you want to fight this "straw man" that doesn't exist.

3. Not one poster has said that other posters should be their heads in the sand and ignore problems, yet you want to fight this straw man that doesn't exist.

4. You apparently believe that it is perfectly okay to criticize, fairly and unfairly, coaches and the team--but it is not right for other posters to disagree with or criticize posters who are being unfairly critical of the coaches/team. Talk about hypocritical.

5. Looks to me that you don't believe it's right for any posters to disagree with your views or opinions or any views or opinions you agree with.

6. The thread title is about it being time "to clean house". Do you even support that premise? It would surprise me if you did, but perhaps you've gone over the deep edge.

 

[ordigger]

geeezus. You can be critical about certain aspects of the team and still be a fan. If you have to be eternally optimistic and choose to be ignorant to areas of concern then you need to put down the koolaid. In fact, being a fan puts you in the position of knowing your team and being accurate with criticism wouldn't you say...

WTF, I agree with IroneagleXP on this. Did someone slip some meth into my beer? :mrgreen:

You know, what's kind of funny is I look at the football forum compared to the basketball forum during the season and it's like night and day. On the football forum if you talk about the weaknesses of the team, how shit just isn't going well on offense, the play calling or some of the "WTF" moments Delaney has had over the years you're a bad fan...

On the basketball forum you have a much smaller group of very dedicated fans that have followed the BB program through some incredibly rough years in the past. Almost all of these fans are perfectly fine with discussing the strengths and weaknesses without it turning into cries of "bad fan" and "sell your tickets" or other crap like that. Sure internet slap fights break out occasionally, and Growler pops up to critique someone's shooting motion on occasion (seriously :lol: ) or claim someone doesn't have NBA talent (who is currently in the NBA), but it's nothing like the FB section.

Makes me wonder... if the much smaller group of Griz BB fans who are diehard fans are OK with discussing problems they see & even perceived coaching mistakes why is it so many FB fans aren't? Could it be some of the koolaid drinkers who view the coaching staff as infallible are more the "social gathering" type of fans and not really into the game itself that much?

I'm not talking about the overly positive yet knowledgeable people who are still capable of seeing issues & discussing them without covering their ears and screaming "bad fan bad fan bad fan." I'm talking about the crowd that seems to just stick their heads in the sand and mutter "NO PROBLEMS HERE, YOU ARE A BAD FAN, DELANEY = NC AND OUR SAVIOR AMEN" incessantly.

Could it be they just don't want to see that there could be a problem because it's not a fun thing to think about for a fan that's used to always being on top? Meanwhile the fans who have seen the highs and lows are willing to discuss it without telling others they are bad fans?

Curious what others think on this. And I'm prepared for the torrent of insults that is likely headed my way.

Hard to compare the two simply because the expectation levels are different. It begins in football with anything less than a NC is not good enough, whereas in basketball, let's just get to the big dance.....and a win would be nice.

IMO...when the Griz have gotten far, the basketball board has gotten just as bad....for example look at the Syracuse and Wisconsin game threads. They were brutal. Lots of hating on D Selvig and surprisingly even Cherry.

Also there is "love" for the Grizzly basketball coaches, Krysko, Tinkle, DeCuire and of course Selvig. However when that other guy (Kennedy) was around....the criticisms were there also (justified IMO). Not true on football board, even th successful coaches have been vilified....Bobby because he couldn't win the big win, Glenn because of how he left, Delaney because people don't like his offense and defenses, etc. Only Pflu seems to be demigod status, and thats because he is in many ways a poster boy for what is wrong with Montana at the administrative level. But even he had critics/haters while coaching. Can you imagine if Read was coaching now? The haters would be hating on him too.

I also believe drama begets drama, and the trolls stay here because they are much more likely to get attention. Many posters are not about good input but creating an image. Why does someone like AlphaGriz only post in football forum (at least majority of time he did). Its because he gets that reaction in football. Look no further than any positive posts (ie example Brints great writeup on Northern Colorado which had 4 comments and 770+ views) vs the drama threads like this one which has 99 comments so far and pushing 3K in views. Truth is trolling, whining and being overly dramatic is a hit on a message board.

Guaranteed if we ever did something like Gonzaga, and made a regional final.....especially across 5-6 years, then if we reverted back to "the norm"....the fake fans would be on that board complaining and whining just as much.